Question about traveling with guns in TX

[cycleguy2300]

How many times does it have to be said, there is no "property owner says it is OK exemption."

I'd say permission is an exemption.

Or for a felony...

If someone chokes their wife it's agg assault FV - Strangulation.
If someone chokes their wife with permission it's kinky.

Or if I have a property posted "no trespassing" (signs, fence, paint, etc) I can still give anyone I choose permission to enter.

The goal of the law is to provide the property owner/manager some strength in keeping guns out IF THEY CHOOSE, not to prevent them from allowing guns if that is their desire.

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[cycleguy2300]

He cannot give the Clinique girl permission to carry. Again, if you will answer the question...do you imagine that the manager would convey control of the store to the Clinique girl, because that is the only way she can carry there minus an LTC?

I disagree, respectfully. Clinique girl can carry WITH PERMISSION. Logic dictates so, even if the law is ambiguous on the details.

Just like you can open carry to hunt on a lease. In some sense the lease is really just permission to open carry and to kill things, even though you may not be in ownership control of the property.

I cannot think of hearing about an arrest where an employee had permission to carry and was arrested/charged with UCW.

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[cycleguy2300]

He cannot give the Clinique girl permission to carry. Again, if you will answer the question...do you imagine that the manager would convey control of the store to the Clinique girl, because that is the only way she can carry there minus an LTC?

I would say, Clinique girl has enough control to issue a trespass warning, she has enough control to carry, certainly if she had permission.

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[cycleguy2300]

You cannot give permission to carry. You can give control of premises. With control of premises, Clinique Girl can decide if she wants to carry, or lock doors and watch tictok videos.

If he can give full control logic follows the owner can give partial control.

I have a lawyer friend who I am about to see. I ask about this. She is rather up on her law and case law in this area.

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[Renegade]

I'd say permission is an exemption.

You'd be wrong.

I guess you did not read the few pages where we pretty much sorted this out.

 

[Axxe55]

You'd be wrong.

I guess you did not read the few pages where we pretty much sorted this out.

So you are saying, that if my family and or friends are openly carrying on my property, at my invitation or permission to be here, and have no carry permits, they are breaking the law?

Seriously, you can't be serious!

 

[Renegade]

The goal of the law is to provide the property owner/manager some strength in keeping guns out IF THEY CHOOSE, not to prevent them from allowing guns if that is their desire.

No, the goal of the law, which was originally passed by the Reconstruction legislature in 1871 , was to prevent ex-Confederates from carrying concealed weapons. it has literally been on the books ever since.

 

[Renegade]

So you are saying, that if my family and or friends are openly carrying on my property, at my invitation or permission to be here, and have no carry permits, they are breaking the law?

Seriously, you can't be serious!

Deja vu much? We already had 10 pages of this discussion starting with post 41....

 

[cycleguy2300]

You'd be wrong.

I guess you did not read the few pages where we pretty much sorted this out.

Maybe you missed where I gave a real example of how permission works...

Does the owner have control of the property if they can't give permission for someone to carry?

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[Renegade]

Maybe you missed where I gave a real example of how permission works...

Maybe you missed 10 pages of this discussion starting around post 41.

 

[cycleguy2300]

Maybe you missed 10 pages of this discussion starting around post 41.

Now you're repeating yourself repeating yourself.

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[popsgarland]

My $0.02 worth.

There is gun fire in the green belt behind my house and the 1st time in the last 14 years, someone put a bullet through my back wall into my house. The police and CSI came out did their thing and left. Before they left I told the officers that if you see me walking around armed, on my property, don't say anything. his response was " no problem, just don't walk towards us". I don't have a LTC, waiting on my DD214, can't find it and applied for another one.

 

[txinvestigator]

I disagree, respectfully. Clinique girl can carry WITH PERMISSION. Logic dictates so, even if the law is ambiguous on the details.

Just like you can open carry to hunt on a lease. In some sense the lease is really just permission to open carry and to kill things, even though you may not be in ownership control of the property.

I cannot think of hearing about an arrest where an employee had permission to carry and was arrested/charged with UCW.

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We've covered this. Permission is not enough. Manager can convey control, and that would probably include the exception to 46.02.

That you don't know about any arrests doesn't mean it's not illegal.

Hunting has its own non-applicibility under 46.15(b) and leases....well, I have to guess but I would imagine a lease would convey some type of control. But I don't Hunt, do I have never dealt with a hunting lease.

 

[txinvestigator]

Does the owner have control of the property if they can't give permission for someone to carry?

Of course.

46.02 and 46.15(b) list when a person carry a handgun. Can you show me the one that reads "with permission of the owner or person in control"?

 

[txinvestigator]

So you are saying, that if my family and or friends are openly carrying on my property, at my invitation or permission to be here, and have no carry permits, they are breaking the law?

Seriously, you can't be serious!

Yes, they are violating Texas Penal Code 46.02. I would argue there is little to no chance of an arrest or charges, but a violation nonetheless.

 

[cycleguy2300]

We've covered this. Permission is not enough. Manager can convey control, and that would probably include the exception to 46.02.

That you don't know about any arrests doesn't mean it's not illegal.

Hunting has its own non-applicibility under 46.15(b) and leases....well, I have to guess but I would imagine a lease would convey some type of control. But I don't Hunt, do I have never dealt with a hunting lease.

Just spoke to an actual lawyer about this.

She laughed and said "of course an owner or manager can give their agent control of the property and they could carry"

I love yall guys, but logic and facts point to an owner being able to give anyone the ability to carry on a property.

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[cycleguy2300]

Yes, they are violating Texas Penal Code 46.02. I would argue there is little to no chance of an arrest or charges, but a violation nonetheless.

Not if the relative has been given some measure of control of the property. (Known colloquially as PERMISSION)

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[txinvestigator]

Not if the relative has been given some measure of control of the property. (Known colloquially as PERMISSION)

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No, it isn't know as permission. Jesus, some of you guys just double down when mistaken.

 

[Bozz10mm]

 

[Hoji]