Shooting low with Red Dot

[rman]

It’s not what it sounds like haha.

I’ve avoided red dots for a long time due to my astigmatism. I eventually acquired a couple pistols with them and have learned how to focus past them, and they become very clear.

So I’ve recently gotten a bunch of red dots and even some slides to accommodate them. I installed suppressor height sights on all of them because I’m anal.

So today I take 3 of them out to make sure my irons are lined up. Overall their dead on.turn on the red dots, which I’ve obsessively zero’d in on the iron sights. I’m consistently shooting low using the dot only. If I line it up with the sights, it’s fine.
They’re all parallax free, so it shouldn’t matter where the dot is in the window, right?

Long story short - red dots are zero’d in. I’m shooting low. What’s wrong with me?

 

[t-astragal]

Dryfire and watch for movement. Also I don’t want irons a dot at the same time. You have to pick the dot or the target as a focal point. I stare at the target personally. With irons in the field of view concurrently, that can be distracting.


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[crosseyedshooter]

What distance is the dot zeroed to? There’s height-over-bore at distances closer than your zero. The most obvious way to demonstrate is put your muzzle right up against the target and that’s where the bullet hole will be but your dot is an inch or two higher.

 

[A1Oni]

It’s not what it sounds like haha.

I’ve avoided red dots for a long time due to my astigmatism. I eventually acquired a couple pistols with them and have learned how to focus past them, and they become very clear.

So I’ve recently gotten a bunch of red dots and even some slides to accommodate them. I installed suppressor height sights on all of them because I’m anal.

So today I take 3 of them out to make sure my irons are lined up. Overall their dead on.turn on the red dots, which I’ve obsessively zero’d in on the iron sights. I’m consistently shooting low using the dot only. If I line it up with the sights, it’s fine.
They’re all parallax free, so it shouldn’t matter where the dot is in the window, right?

Long story short - red dots are zero’d in. I’m shooting low. What’s wrong with me?

did you cowitness the dot with the sights? because they shouldnt be cowitnessed with the sights on a handgun.

 

[Texan79423]

What distance is a good distance to zero a EDC handgun?

 

[perfor8]

did you cowitness the dot with the sights? because they shouldnt be cowitnessed with the sights on a handgun.

Why not? I don't do red dots on pistols - so I'm curious why they shouldn't be co-witnessed.

 

[crosseyedshooter]

What distance is a good distance to zero a EDC handgun?

I like to zero at 10 yards and verify windage at 25 yards. It makes the math easy. If your dot adjustment is 1MOA per click, it’s 10 clicks per inch at 10 yards and 4 clicks per inch at 25.

 

[crosseyedshooter]

Why not? I don't do red dots on pistols - so I'm curious why they shouldn't be co-witnessed.

“Cowitness” gets thrown about but not everyone uses the same definition. Red dot should always be zeroed independently and will have a fixed relation to the iron sights when lined up. The dot could land on the front sight post, hover just above it, or somewhere around it. Zeroing the dot to iron sights will get you close, but zeroing the dot independently will be exact.

 

[rman]

What distance is the dot zeroed to? There’s height-over-bore at distances closer than your zero. The most obvious way to demonstrate is put your muzzle right up against the target and that’s where the bullet hole will be but your dot is an inch or two higher.

Wow, this made me feel stupid haha.

Even stupider when I noticed going from 5 to 7 raised the POI.

I will likely zero them all in between 7-10y since that’s typically the distance I train at.

 

[rman]

did you cowitness the dot with the sights? because they shouldnt be cowitnessed with the sights on a handgun.

Yes, absolute cowitness. I am going to re-zero them at my training distances for my EDCs.

I use suppressor-height sights on all my red dot pistols. I’ve been shooting combat sight picture my whole life and I’m not willing to deviate from that. 8/8 (sig) equivalent sights seem to be perfect for 9mm.

 

[t-astragal]

Zeroing at 7-10 yards or 50 yards makes no real difference in a defensive situation. Poi is not significantly different. If you’re shooting bullseye for score, maybe give it 3-4 clicks.

Pulling the trigger smoothly is the only thing that dramatically affects the shot.


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[Bozz10mm]

Zeroing at 7-10 yards or 50 yards makes no real difference in a defensive situation. Poi is not significantly different. If you’re shooting bullseye for score, maybe give it 3-4 clicks.

Pulling the trigger smoothly is the only thing that dramatically affects the shot.


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Pretty much agree with that. At defensive distances and situations you aren't going to be aiming for the buttons on his shirt. Center of mass can easily be obtained at 3-7 yards even without sights as long as you have good trigger pull. So, zero the red dot independently of the iron sights at about 15 yards. You'll be just fine.

 

[rman]

Thanks guys. I tend to obsess over trivial issues.

Brand new p365x-macro and slamming the mag sends the slide home. Only other gun that did that for me was a sp2022.

Everyone saying that every gun does that. Most guns do that. It’s literally only the 2nd of dozens of handguns that have done that for me.

Does it matter? No.
But it’s almost keeping me up at night
That is not the design of the gun, therefore unless I’ve modified it to intentionally do so, it’s an issue for me. A flaw.

It’s one of 3 current EDCs (p365x and p320x carry). I want them to all operate the same.

 

[perfor8]

“Cowitness” gets thrown about but not everyone uses the same definition. Red dot should always be zeroed independently and will have a fixed relation to the iron sights when lined up. The dot could land on the front sight post, hover just above it, or somewhere around it. Zeroing the dot to iron sights will get you close, but zeroing the dot independently will be exact.

Nonsense. If the iron sights are correct and the dot is correct, they'll co-witness.

 

[TheMailMan]

Ummm.....nope.

 

[A1Oni]

What distance is a good distance to zero a EDC handgun?

25 yards max but a 7 yard zero minimum

 

[A1Oni]

Yes, absolute cowitness. I am going to re-zero them at my training distances for my EDCs.

I use suppressor-height sights on all my red dot pistols. I’ve been shooting combat sight picture my whole life and I’m not willing to deviate from that. 8/8 (sig) equivalent sights seem to be perfect for 9mm.

your zero should match where the bullets go, not where the sights are my guy, your irons are for back up use only

 

[A1Oni]

Nonsense. If the iron sights are correct and the dot is correct, they'll co-witness.

not nessiciarily no.

 

[t-astragal]

25 yards max but a 7 yard zero minimum

What’s the difference?


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[A1Oni]

What’s the difference?


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Most shootings typically happen at 7 yards or so there are exceptions of course but one must be prepared for both.