Your road rage stories? How do you handle it.

[zincwarrior]

Sticks and stones will get you shot, but words (and birds) will never hurt me.

OT-but hey lets step this thread down a notch-
We had an ancient wiener dog along with the other weiner dog and Dad's old Mountain dog for years. He was 8 lbs of old man rage (so think tiny, old wiener dog with bad eyesight and hearing). There was one time I heard him bark (he didn't bark. When he did he was usually in trouble).

Quickly went out and noticed the mountain dog was standing over him-I mean literally over him (he was so small it was like an elephant standing over a cat) and growling looking up. I followed LOS and there was a vulture about tree height right above us. The mountain dog was protecting him. Moral of the story: if the bird is big enough, it can hurt you. Best to have a shotgun at all times.

 

[TheDan]

if the bird is big enough...

 

[zincwarrior]

WHAT HAS BEEN SEEN CANNOT BE UNSEEN.

 

[Maverick44]

Interpretation of law by making "universal statements" is always interesting, but flawed. Fun for the internetz though. As ancient Yoda would say: "rely on them not, you should."


EDIT: if this sounds hostile it is not meant to, but these are issues of criminal law. While they may be discussed it is important to remember, if you have a criminal law question, be sure to consult criminal counsel (but I repeat myself heh heh) on how to proceed in the Real World (TM).

I'm not claiming to be a lawyer or an expert on law, but those are very plainly stated laws. It doesn't take a lawyer to read something stated in plain English. The fact is, you cannot provoke a fight and then claim self defense unless you retreat, and giving someone the bird can be considered provocative.

It's simple. Don't be an ass to strangers, and it becomes a non issue.

Going forward-don't give the finger to someone. It helps avoid the conflict and issues of provocation become irrelevant.

This is the only point I'm arguing.

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[zincwarrior]

I'm not claiming to be a lawyer or an expert on law, but those are very plainly stated laws. It doesn't take a lawyer to read something stated in plain English. The fact is, you cannot provoke a fight and then claim self defense unless you retreat, and giving someone the bird can be considered provocative.

We disagree. The definition of provoked with will come from statute and case law, as well as the trier of fact. After all grandma giving someone the finger doesn't obviate her right to self defense.

It's simple. Don't be an ass to strangers, and it becomes a non issue.

Agreed! The secondary issue is really the primary one! Don't intentionally act like an ass and these types of things help to be avoided. As I have acted like an ass in the past, I can vouch for it.

 

[Maverick44]

After all grandma giving someone the finger doesn't obviate her right to self defense.

According to your argument, it might since it depends on the interpretation of the word provoke.





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[Moonpie]

If you don't like the way I drive then stay the hell off the sidewalk!

 

[zincwarrior]

According to your argument, it might since it depends on the interpretation of the word provoke.





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[SidewaysTA]

Maverick is laying down a Penal smack down in here.


It's almost obscene.


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Not only that, he's been beating TXI to the punch every time.

Come on TXI, you're slipping man.

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[Mexican_Hippie]

What if you're just a huge fan of theirs?

Offensive? Not offensive?

 

[SidewaysTA]

How can anyone be offended by their number 1 fan?

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[Maverick44]

 

[casp625]

To be fair, I don't think that giving someone the bird provokes another to do anything. If someone is driving reckless and you happen to pull up to the light next to them and you yell "learn to drive buddy!" and he tries to attack you, would you lose your right to defense under Chapter 9?

 

[Mexican_Hippie]

The finger is free speech. The laws that codify some sort of provocation with language or features are utter bullshit morally.

You never have a right to assault someone just because if something they say to you or the finger.

If I was on a jury I would definitely nullify those BS laws in my consideration of the verdict.

Do you hear me Tarrant County? Don't pick me for jury duty! ha ha

 

[zincwarrior]

I don't see how the finger defense to aggression as a provocation stops anything actually. I can stand next to you and give you the finger. If you then batter me you are committing a criminal act, not I.

Well giving them the bird, while still in your vehicle - I don't see how that could suspend any rights. Neither party has the right to self defense at that point. In the chain of facts presented we would still be several steps from SD. After all this is in the vehicle and both vehicles are moving (no one is fighting or threatening battery-even with the vehicle).

Now if as a result of A giving B the finger, if B then cuts off A or threatens A, thats further along the chain of facts and self defense would be based on those actions then. To that point A has not committed battery, etc.

but as noted, while legally it might not mean anything, if A does it A is aggravating the situation-there is no good outcome of it.

 

[ZX9RCAM]

So, would it matter who stopped their vehicle "first", in an effort to initiate an actual physical altercation?

 

[zincwarrior]

So, would it matter who stopped their vehicle "first", in an effort to initiate an actual physical altercation?

I bet it would to a jury.

 

[TheDan]

The finger is free speech. The laws that codify some sort of provocation with language or features are utter bullshit morally.

You never have a right to assault someone just because if something they say to you or the finger.

Them's fight'n words!

 

[zincwarrior]

Gives whole new meaning to the term "pull my finger!"

 

[ZX9RCAM]

This is an old video, just came across it again today.