Apache Vs Innocent Photographers??

[RogerEMT]

Ok.. I have my opinion, but I would like to know what everyone else thinks. I'm sure there will be some crazy debates on this thread. Lets keep it professional gentlemen. Also, is there actual evidence that they were photographers? I've heard of insurgents using camera's to film attacks, so... I'm confused...

YouTube - WikiLeaks releases secret video of journalists, civilians killed in Baghdad.

 

[cuate]

Somewhat milder than insurgents on arab TV cutting off Mr. Pearl's head some time ago. Much milder than the scenes of the Imperial Japanese Army during "The Rape of Nanking". Milder than the massacres at the Alamo & Goliad and about par with the Battle of San Jacinto, in Texas. Sometimes we are killed by guns run amok and other times by Governments run amok like Health Care.

 

[The_Hunter]

Looks like a clean shoot to me. Note: If you are going to inbed during a war make sure your side had the best guns

 

[Roscoe]

I'm in Iraq right now; and have been here for the past 18 months. Newsmen are not inbedded with the insurgents, even Al Jezeera doesn't have their people out in the field on their own. As many Arab reporters have been kidnapped and killed as Westerners. Weapons were found among the bodies; there was fighting going on throughout the neighborhood. I'd say the shooting was justified.

 

[Major Woody]

I can't determine whether it was justified, but the attitudes of the helicopter personnel concerns me. If they make it back, they will be LEO's patrolling our streets possibly someday. They need better optics. They ended up shooting the 'medics' that came to treated the wounded.

 

[Burt Gummer]

I can't determine whether it was justified, but the attitudes of the helicopter personnel concerns me. If they make it back, they will be LEO's patrolling our streets possibly someday. They need better optics. They ended up shooting the 'medics' that came to treated the wounded.

When you make the decision to kill a man in battle you need to stick with it. It is not necessary to say kind words as you end his life. Killing brings out an instinct which can make you say and do non-politically correct things (go figure).
As for the "medics", do you think the medics were friendlies or do you think they were insurgents with the bad guys? We follow many combat rules and if they had a marked ambulance and personnel with markings they would not have been fired upon. When a group of guys roll up and throw a body in the back, then PICK UP THE DROPPED WEAPONS, they differentiate themselves from standard medics.

These guys were armed insurgents with a camera. This does not make one a "reporter". If I walk into a Wal Mart with an AK and a camera, then get shot by police while doing this activity, I am not a deceased "reporter".

Did anybody notice how they were set up in the path of a US convoy? At the beginning a guy was peeking around a building for the US forces.


War is hell.

Life is tough...it's even tougher when you are fighting against the U.S. military.

 

[Dcav]

When you make the decision to kill a man in battle you need to stick with it. It is not necessary to say kind words as you end his life. Killing brings out an instinct which can make you say and do non-politically correct things (go figure).
As for the "medics", do you think the medics were friendlies or do you think they were insurgents with the bad guys? We follow many combat rules and if they had a marked ambulance and personnel with markings they would not have been fired upon. When a group of guys roll up and throw a body in the back, then PICK UP THE DROPPED WEAPONS, they differentiate themselves from standard medics.

These guys were armed insurgents with a camera. This does not make one a "reporter". If I walk into a Wal Mart with an AK and a camera, then get shot by police while doing this activity, I am not a deceased "reporter".

Did anybody notice how they were set up in the path of a US convoy? At the beginning a guy was peeking around a building for the US forces.


War is hell.

Life is tough...it's even tougher when you are fighting against the U.S. military.

Well said.

 

[Texas42]

+1, I make it a habbit to stand away from people with RPG's and AK's in a warzone.

 

[texas skeeter]

YUP!! im with Burt on this one!! and they were definately there in the wrong place at the wrong time, and it wasnt for reporting!! so they got what they deserved end of story!! i got a good idea, if ya dont want to get shot, stay out of a war zone!!!!!

 

[tmd11111]

Sucks to be on the loosing team......

 

[Clockwork]

This topic is TOTALLY not what I thought it would be.

I was expecting something about a native American chasing some journalists with a tomahawk...

>_> I'm actually a little disappointed... that woulda been cool.

 

[RogerEMT]

This topic is TOTALLY not what I thought it would be.

I was expecting something about a native American chasing some journalists with a tomahawk...

>_> I'm actually a little disappointed... that woulda been cool.

Butthead....

 

[Clockwork]

No u

 

[RogerEMT]

LOL... I was doing image searches for a pic of an indian chasing a photographer.. No luck... Just the baseball team..

 

[DirtyD]

I have a hard time sympathizing with stupidity. While in Baghdad in '03 we lost one of ours to friendly sniper fire. We were set up in an overwatch position to provide flank security during an ambush. This individual stood up, dropped his kevlar and IBA and lit up a cig. Our sniper, from about 800 meters away, saw an individual with a weapon slung over his shoulder standing 30 feet to our rear smoking a cigarette at night with none of the gear that identified him as friendly, he made a snap decision. While he has a hard time dealing emotionally with the results he was cleared of any wrong doing under the investigation and none of us harbour any ill feelings towards him. When you are doing the wrong thing in the wrong place at the wrong time in a combat zone you should expect to die.....

 

[Texas42]

Yahoo is running a big story on this. . . . .

 

[Burt Gummer]

I have a hard time sympathizing with stupidity. While in Baghdad in '03 we lost one of ours to friendly sniper fire. We were set up in an overwatch position to provide flank security during an ambush. This individual stood up, dropped his kevlar and IBA and lit up a cig. Our sniper, from about 800 meters away, saw an individual with a weapon slung over his shoulder standing 30 feet to our rear smoking a cigarette at night with none of the gear that identified him as friendly, he made a snap decision. While he has a hard time dealing emotionally with the results he was cleared of any wrong doing under the investigation and none of us harbour any ill feelings towards him. When you are doing the wrong thing in the wrong place at the wrong time in a combat zone you should expect to die.....

Complacency kills.


According to Yahoo, the guys included 2 contractors hired by Reuters for reporting.
Leaked video shows civilian killings in Iraq, signifies growing power of independent Web journalism - Yahoo! News

Note to self, if running around with a gaggle of folks with AK 47's in front of a US patrol, tell somebody you are one of the "good guys" instead of trying to be reporter/ninja.
http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/201889.php

 

[DoubleActionCHL]

I'm not going to criticize the decision to shoot these guys. We don't have enough information to armchair quarterback these guys, and it's not unusual for the insurgents to pose as reporters, etc., and use women and children as effective human shields. On the other hand, I was a bit disturbed by the glee in which these guys did their jobs. Maybe I'm misreading it, but they seemed to enjoy blowing these guys up. They seemed detached, as if these were not real human beings they were shooting at; a video game, perhaps. That attitude bothers me, especially when these guys come home and take jobs as police officers or IRS enforcement agents.

 

[robin303]

Kill them all and let God sort them out. Videos and Photos of Army Special Ops, Navy SEALs, Air Force, Marines, Coast Guard in Action - Shock and Awe - Military.com

 

[TimberWolf7.62]

On the other hand, I was a bit disturbed by the glee in which these guys did their jobs. Maybe I'm misreading it, but they seemed to enjoy blowing these guys up. They seemed detached, as if these were not real human beings they were shooting at; a video game, perhaps. That attitude bothers me, especially when these guys come home and take jobs as police officers or IRS enforcement agents.

I would MUCH rather they have that attitude than to break down and cry (and become combat ineffective). Look at it this way - this is the enemy. The enemy is killing a lot of our guys with IEDs and not showing themselves. That's frustrating as hell for our troops, so to get a chance to see a group of them and to blow them up is, indeed, a happy event. "What do you feel when you kill a terrorist? Answer: Recoil."

RE: there being "reporters" in the group - as others have already said, be careful which side you embed with. How many Western reporters have the Iraqis killed?

My sympathy level for these "reporters" is ZERO.