Ukraine invasion

[Havok1]

I've seen various rankings, depending on who's doing the ranking. Doesn't change the straw man nature of the argument that one country doesn't deserve support because their government is corrupt. They all are.

whether they are all corrupt or not doesn’t matter. Just because every nation is some amount of corrupt doesn’t mean they are all equally corrupt. It also doesn’t mean we should ignore Ukraines corruption or that we should be supporting them.

 

[cycleguy2300]

They didn't find one? Or we never heard that they found one?
If they can squash info about effective existing meds for Covid, it's probably trivial to lose a story on a Dim-funded biolab.

Then how did the info about these evil "biolabs" get out in the first place.

Saying "they squash info" then pretending they could start rumors about them and get that out is not logically consistent. You did hear about effective covid treatments even though there was a concerted effort to hush it up, you've heard about all sorts of things that "they" want silenced.

The problem with conspiracies like this is the believer keep changing the rules and making exceptions to the changed rules until it becomes a psychotic delusion.

The believers claimed "biolabs" were one of the reasons the rashists invaded, if that were the case, the rashists could be expected to present even thin evidence of them to justify to the world their terrible actions, but they havent...

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[General Zod]

whether they are all corrupt or not doesn’t matter. Just because every nation is some amount of corrupt doesn’t mean they are all equally corrupt. It also doesn’t mean we should ignore Ukraines corruption or that we should be supporting them.

Better than supporting Russia, a nation that has taken government corruption to unheard of levels. When a country is invaded for conquest, I consider it bad form to root for the invaders and dismiss the defenders as "too corrupt". Especially when the invaders are a completely corrupt oligarchy that's run like a crime family, complete with sloppy assassinations when people get out of line.

 

[Havok1]

Better than supporting Russia, a nation that has taken government corruption to unheard of levels. When a country is invaded for conquest, I consider it bad form to root for the invaders and dismiss the defenders as "too corrupt". Especially when the invaders are a completely corrupt oligarchy that's run like a crime family, complete with sloppy assassinations when people get out of line.

Believe it or not, supporting Russia and supporting the Ukrainian government are not the only two options.

 

[candcallen]

Phuking mental gymnastics.

What's important? What will ever change about governments? What are your goals and what can you live with?

If the bitch slapping of putin helps the Ukrainian people without our troops involved in combat then great. Ofcourse the gooberment in Ukraine will benefit as well. Saying we shouldn't help Ukraine cause the gooberment is corrupt is naive. All governments are corrupt, if that's your standard then it's straw man at best. Deflecting from reality of the totality of the situation.

So if Ukraine government benefits by the destruction of Russian military invaders, the faltering of Russia on the world stage the loss of power of putin within Russia and maintaining the sovereignty of Ukraine?

I can live with that. We wouldn't be here if the world had a little more backbone the last time in regards to Crimea.

You can ofcourse bitch slap putin and meet those goals without giving a dime to Ukraine but that will involve nato and probably US troops. I can't live with that. I doubt neither could putin.

Some say, I said this myself at times but dont believe it now, you could have stopped this to begin with by asserting Nato will never allow Ukraine to join. But as we see Putin had several excuses for this....nazis, labs, freeing Russian people stuk in Ukraine.... so that he was going to invade regardless and like most issues foundation for his boldness was the past, the impotent Obama response to Crimea and his desire to revive the ussr. The only way this wasn't going to happen was putin dying before he started it. And yes the tard in the Whitehouse made him feel like no one would push back. Well that didn't happen did it.

So here we are. History clearly shows there is no "peace in our time" thru appeasing a mad man. Make no doubt about it putin is is mad man, a wanna be second coming of stalin seeking to reassert the soviet union in all its glory. So the question iscwhat can you live with.

Proxy wars suck. They are a cesspool of entanglement and drain on resources and are so murky that you never can see the hidden dangers. They also helped win the cold war.

So under the circumstances, while I would rather see money used to defend our borders and destroy cartels, I can live with sending it to Ukraine and helping them destroy putins standing at home, on the world stage and his army in Ukraine. Could this spiral out of control? Absolutely but so could allowing putin to take Ukraine.

So buckle up. We're committed at this point. Spring is coming and Russia will go WW2 full on carnage and over run Ukraine or they will be destroyed by superior tech and the resources of the west.

Who will blink? Regardless the corruption will remain.

 

[oldag]

They didn't find one? Or we never heard that they found one?
If they can squash info about effective existing meds for Covid, it's probably trivial to lose a story on a Dim-funded biolab.

Had there been anything at all, Putin would have trumpeted it to the world to justify his actions.

 

[oldag]

whether they are all corrupt or not doesn’t matter. Just because every nation is some amount of corrupt doesn’t mean they are all equally corrupt. It also doesn’t mean we should ignore Ukraines corruption or that we should be supporting them.

So you are going to quit paying all taxes, since the U.S. government is corrupt?

 

[kbaxter60]

Had there been anything at all, Putin would have trumpeted it to the world to justify his actions.

Likely true. And if my Pravda subscription had not lapsed, I may have seen it.
As for MSNBCBSCBCNN, if it had one whit of bad juju for the Biden crime family, they would hit it with the red "Misinformation" stamp and done!

 

[Havok1]

So you are going to quit paying all taxes, since the U.S. government is corrupt?

It would be ideal.

 

[oldag]

It would be ideal.

But are you going to stop paying all taxes now? Not a theoretical question.

If not, you are helping support a corrupt government.

 

[cycleguy2300]

Believe it or not, supporting Russia and supporting the Ukrainian government are not the only two options.

Correct, but but the only real question HERE is why should one support either Ukraine or Russia.

We have seen who you support...

Only a coward or a fool can look at this conflict and say they don't care or can't decide who is righter or wronger, good or bad. A fool because they cannot understand and so do not see why they need to care, a coward because they fear making a stand even when the right choice is plainly laid out before them. The only thing worse than being a coward or a fool is to be the kind that attempts to befuddled others into being confused so their own foolishness or cowardice has company.

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[cycleguy2300]

Its not only fools and cowards attempting to mislead into inaction or opposition to Ukraine.

See the Ukrainian fascists having a wedding?

There is a whole reddit thread on it being russians in russia and being photoshopped by russia to be something it isnt...

It is actually some russian nazis in Novokuznetsk...

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[Havok1]

But are you going to stop paying all taxes now? Not a theoretical question.

If not, you are helping support a corrupt government.

Paying taxes isn’t exactly a choice. You’re not proving a point, you’re deflecting from the topic.

 

[Havok1]

Correct, but but the only real question HERE is why should one support either Ukraine or Russia.

We have seen who you support...

Only a coward or a fool can look at this conflict and say they don't care or can't decide who is righter or wronger, good or bad. A fool because they cannot understand and so do not see why they need to care, a coward because they fear making a stand even when the right choice is plainly laid out before them. The only thing worse than being a coward or a fool is to be the kind that attempts to befuddled others into being confused so their own foolishness or cowardice has company.

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Lol. Who do I support?

 

[benenglish]

Correct, but but the only real question HERE is why should one support either Ukraine or Russia.

In the recent Joe Rogan podcast with Peter Zeihan, they start off talking about the war. It's a long podcast but if folks are willing to fire up Spotify and listen, in the first 10 minutes Zeihan manages to clearly and simply explain that, as they say in some subreddits, "everybody sucks here" but supporting Ukraine is really the only rational choice. He dispenses with politics and cuts right to the heart of the practical reality of the situation.

I recommend the entire program but just the first 10-15 minutes are very, very enlightening regarding this war. It's dumbed down quite a bit for first time listeners of Zeihan but still worthwhile.

 

[oldag]

Paying taxes isn’t exactly a choice. You’re not proving a point, you’re deflecting from the topic.

Sure it is. You don't want to financially support one corrupt government (Ukraine) but yet you are financially supporting another corrupt government.

 

[Havok1]

Sure it is. You don't want to financially support one corrupt government (Ukraine) but yet you are financially supporting another corrupt government.

No it isn’t. Go troll elsewhere.

 

[cycleguy2300]

Paying taxes isn’t exactly a choice. You’re not proving a point, you’re deflecting from the topic.

Paying taxes is just as much a choice as anything else... and again you want to pretend some things, like supplying arms to those fighting an invasion are choices, but other things like paying taxes are not. Your logic is fetid and inconsistent.

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[Havok1]

Paying taxes is just as much a choice as anything else... and again you want to pretend some things, like supplying arms to those fighting an invasion are choices, but other things like paying taxes are not. Your logic is fetid and inconsistent.

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I can not go buy something from the store and not pay the tax on it. That’s not an option. I can’t not pay tax on my income either. although I can’t stop the government from sending weapons to ukraine, the government does have a choice not to do it. Sending weapons to ukraine is not the default choice.

You once again, are as far off as a Ukrainian missile landing in the wrong country.

Still waiting on you to say who exactly it is I support.

 

[cycleguy2300]

I can not go buy something from the store and not pay the tax on it. That’s not an option. I can’t not pay tax on my income either. although I can’t stop the government from sending weapons to ukraine, the government does have a choice not to do it. Sending weapons to ukraine is not the default choice.

You once again, are as far off as a Ukrainian missile landing in the wrong country.

Still waiting on you to say who exactly it is I support.

When you choose to buy, you choose to pay the taxes and lots of people have chosen to not pay income taxes... you just don't want to make the choices that are required to not pay taxes.



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