Arlington, TX Cop tries to shoot dog, kills woman

[Bithabus]

With great power comes great responsibility. LEOs have enormous power over regular citizens, and they should be expected to perform to a higher standard. Dogs are pretty good at sizing up humans. If you're a pussy and became a cop because you were bullied in HS, they can tell.

 

[Sublime]

Should he ask for a mulligan?


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Sure. I mean I don't play golf and that has nothing to do with my reply but yeah, give him a do over.

 

[Sublime]

By the same token, people don’t wake up and say “Today’s the day I’m going to get a DUI and kill a bus full of nuns,” either, but it’s okay to criticize that dude’s poor decision-making.

Which brings up decision-making as a quality desired of LEOs; I’d wager shooting the unconscious person you were trying to find isn’t exactly the greatest decision-making out there.

So yeah, it’s expected LEOs are going to make a mistake, but on the continuum of NBD to BFD, this one is a BFD and is certainly worthy of criticism.

But then again, I’m of the variety that says if you can’t own your mistakes, then you shouldn’t make them.

Pfft, not the same. The analogy is way off. My reply was in response to how LEOs live to violate everyone's civil liberties, they don't. The officer did not "decide" to shoot the unconscious person (she became conscious apparently because she told them she was shot), he "chose" to shoot the dog and missed. Was he a pussy? I dunno and I dunno what kind of dog it was. Had he not attempted to shoot the dog and gotten bit. No one here would say shit. Had he shot and killed the dog, maybe it would be a local story but still probably no one here would say shit. Bad Shot? Yes. Terrible a woman got shot and died? Yes. Who said he is not owning up to it? The news story sure as hell doesn't say that. I guess an assumption on your part? What about her decision to be passed out in a field? Does she take any blame? Was it her dog? Terrible thing for everyone

Criticize all you want, we are on a forum. We don't have to know what we are talking about to post.

 

[Sublime]

I know I am going to get flamed by our resident LEOs, but fuckit, here goes.

The biggest bunch of pussies in the country when it comes to dogs seems to be LE these days.Seriously, if the sight of a barking dog causes you to shit yourself explosively and go straight to the gun, you really need to be in another line of work.

My dad retired from the Alabama Highway Patrol. Anyone want to take a guess on how many growling, snarling, aggressive dogs he shot while working in Alabama in the 60s and 70s? That would be zero.

I shot zero from 90-99 in a city that borders Arlington. That really doesn't mean much either way. How many dogs attacked him? I had a buddy shoot a Rot with a 12g. Should he have gotten bitten to prove he was not a pussy? Also, how can you type pussies and when I type pussy, it is filtered out?

 

[toddnjoyce]

Pfft, not the same. The analogy is way off. My reply was in response to how LEOs live to violate everyone's civil liberties, they don't. The officer did not "decide" to shoot the unconscious person (she became conscious apparently because she told them she was shot), he "chose" to shoot the dog and missed. Was he a *****? I dunno and I dunno what kind of dog it was. Had he not attempted to shoot the dog and gotten bit. No one here would say shit. Had he shot and killed the dog, maybe it would be a local story but still probably no one here would say shit. Bad Shot? Yes. Terrible a woman got shot and died? Yes. Who said he is not owning up to it? The news story sure as hell doesn't say that. I guess an assumption on your part? What about her decision to be passed out in a field? Does she take any blame? Was it her dog? Terrible thing for everyone

Criticize all you want, we are on a forum. We don't have to know what we are talking about to post.

Curious why you’re so defensive?

And yes, I generally believe it’s a bad decision to shoot down toward the ground in an area in which there is a reported unconscious person who has not been located and is the reason I’m there in the first place.

Honestly, I’d probably start looking for the person where that dog was coming from because it’s plausible the dog was a pet of the unconscious person and was protecting them.

 

[TxStetson]

I wasn’t criticizing the cop, YET. I was saying this story doesn’t pass the smell test.

When a police officer saw the woman lying in the grass, he approached and called out to her, and a dog ran toward him. Backing up, he fired his gun "multiples times toward the dog."

The woman then yelled out that she'd been hit.


Obviously he was focusing on the woman. How the hell do you go from focusing on her to shooting her?

Once the actual story comes out, I suspect there will be lots of criticism showing up.

 

[Mowingmaniac 24/7]

Yeah, but jumping on the band wagon is so much fun, most especially when I wasn't there or really 'know' all the particulars.

Crap, whadda ya want, impartiality?

P.S. I got a ticket when speeding one time and another time I spent the night in jail for well, I ain't telling, but now, heh, heh, 'now' I'm gettin me some paaaaaaaaay-back!

 

[Renegade]

His employment app for the ATF will be one question:

Did you kill the dog?
Yes - you’re hired
No - get lost

There is special consideration though when you miss the target and kill an innocent woman. Oh wait, that is the FBI app...

 

[Renegade]

The biggest bunch of pussies in the country when it comes to dogs seems to be LE these days.

The greatest mystery in the universe is why so many USPS, UPS, Fedex, meter maids, seem to be able to do their jobs without shooting dogs, but police cannot.

 

[Sublime]

Curious why you’re so defensive?

And yes, I generally believe it’s a bad decision to shoot down toward the ground in an area in which there is a reported unconscious person who has not been located and is the reason I’m there in the first place.

Honestly, I’d probably start looking for the person where that dog was coming from because it’s plausible the dog was a pet of the unconscious person and was protecting them.

Not defensive, just disagree with you.
Well we know it was a bad decision now. Had he shot the dog and not the woman, again, no one would say anything.

In your last paragraph, the assumption is he did not know where the woman was yet so again, shooting a dog rushing at you is not unheard of. Maybe the dog was protecting its owner. I dunno. You dunno and doesnt sound like the officer knew either but what difference does that make IF a dog is attacking you?

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[Sublime]

Yeah, but jumping on the band wagon is so much fun, most especially when I wasn't there or really 'know' all the particulars.

I guess that is my issue. It is easy to do on a forum and LE seems an easy mark in today's climate. Meanwhile CLEAT just posted on their wall that TX again leads the US in officers killed while on duty. It is a thankless job where everyone is a critic. The guy in your cage is a lawyer. The guy you cuffed NOW wants to kick your ass. The woman you just cited makes a formal complaint on you, etc.

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[BillFairbanks]

I would be interested in how Police Departments train officers to deal with dogs. I don't understand why shooting the dog seems to be the first option for some.

I'm no cop, but I've had several interactions with aggressive dogs. I was bit by a dog while passing out food in a fair park neighborhood to "needy" families. I broke up a dog fight in neighborhood near Hulen. And most recently, while walking in our neighborhood, a German Shepard bolted out of a house and ran aggressively while barking and growling at me and my wife. In the most recent incident, I had my gun. However, I decided not to use it and I just stood my ground until the dog got to us. When the dog realized I wasn't scared of it or going to run, it calmed down and let me retrieve it for its owners.

I know trained police dogs, certain breeds and rabid dogs can be very dangerous. However, in my experience most dogs which appear aggressive are doing so out of fear and will respond to firm commands.

When my wife was shot and the police responded to my house, I was concerned that an officer would shoot one or both of my dogs. Thankfully, my dogs didn't react aggressively to the first responders, despite the chaos, and the police & paramedics acted very professionally and took good care of my wife, dogs and property.

 

[Renegade]

Video is up - rookie officer who just finished FT last month. dog has minor wound.

https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/l...-dog/287-41d47d97-f488-434f-97bf-10e5176573f4

 

[toddnjoyce]

I guess that is my issue. It is easy to do on a forum and LE seems an easy mark in today's climate. Meanwhile CLEAT just posted on their wall that TX again leads the US in officers killed while on duty. It is a thankless job where everyone is a critic. The guy in your cage is a lawyer. The guy you cuffed NOW wants to kick your ass. The woman you just cited makes a formal complaint on you, etc.

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And here’s my issue; I’m an ardent LE supporter, but that doesn’t mean they walk on water, either.

As someone else mentioned, the available information just doesn’t pass the common sense test.

Doesn’t mean the LEO is a bad guy, but it does mean that in instances such as this, the agency needs aggressively address the issue. The days of simply claiming “the officer involved shooting investigation is underway and we can’t comment on that” are over in questionable instances because there’s been enough episodes of LEOs deciding that yes, today is the day I’m going to violate someone’s civil rights.

What bothers me most is that a department can spend years building a trust relationship with the public and it only takes only takes one instance such as this to ruin it. The less transparent the agency is in the immediate aftermath, erodes that trust and makes the average LEOs job that much harder.

That means LE agencies have to recognize a different approach has to be taken in instances such as this. Unfortunately, unions and lawyers won’t let that happen, so they end up portraying an adversarial relationship to the citizens, compounding that erosion of trust. People will forgive a mistake, they’ll appreciate informative communication, they will abhor a wall of silence.

 

[Sublime]

And here’s my issue; I’m an ardent LE supporter, but that doesn’t mean they walk on water, either.

As someone else mentioned, the available information just doesn’t pass the common sense test.

Doesn’t mean the LEO is a bad guy, but it does mean that in instances such as this, the agency needs aggressively address the issue. The days of simply claiming “the officer involved shooting investigation is underway and we can’t comment on that” are over in questionable instances because there’s been enough episodes of LEOs deciding that yes, today is the day I’m going to violate someone’s civil rights.

What bothers me most is that a department can spend years building a trust relationship with the public and it only takes only takes one instance such as this to ruin it. The less transparent the agency is in the immediate aftermath, erodes that trust and makes the average LEOs job that much harder.

That means LE agencies have to recognize a different approach has to be taken in instances such as this. Unfortunately, unions and lawyers won’t let that happen, so they end up portraying an adversarial relationship to the citizens, compounding that erosion of trust. People will forgive a mistake, they’ll appreciate informative communication, they will abhor a wall of silence.

I never said LEOs walk on water. I just think you made a lot of faulty assumptions.

The whole build trust in the community is BS and a throwback to community policing but that is a whole different issue than here. Basically what you stated is that because of this one incident you would now distrust APD if you lived in Arlington. Seems a bit much to me.

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[toddnjoyce]

I never said LEOs walk on water. I just think you made a lot of faulty assumptions.

The whole build trust in the community is BS and a throwback to community policing but that is a whole different issue than here. Basically what you stated is that because of this one incident you would now distrust APD if you lived in Arlington. Seems a bit much to me.

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What I stated is that it in some instances, events like this can erode trust built over time, which makes it harder on the average LEO.

I’d like to hear why you believe LE building trust with the community is BS, though.

 

[Sublime]

What I stated is that it in some instances, events like this can erode trust built over time, which makes it harder on the average LEO.

I’d like to hear why you believe LE building trust with the community is BS, though.

It is harder on the average LEO than ever before but it isn't because police actions (generally) have eroded the trust. The same people the police usually contact on a daily basis are easily compared to supporters of the left, antifa, and BLM - criminals. You are never going to get the trust of these people. The people that do trust LE generally have very little contact with them. That trust erodes when you have story after story painting LEOs in a negative light. Those meida stories are short on facts and big on assumptions. These same people that trusted LE start to question LE actions (perhaps you are one of them). Throw in the fact that so many have 0 inkling of what goes on in police work and well it makes it worse.

the ideas of the IACP and community policing brought on by the public demanding something be done and citizen review boards and Chiefs and Sheriffs wanting to keep their positions have made most agencies kinder and gentler. You see those stories all the time - Sgt. in Uniform playing Basketball with youths, Cops installing a window unit for seniors, donut breakfasts in poorer communities. It's all BS. What you want is your uniform patrol force going out and being pro active in stopping crime. The problem is they arrest these thugs and POS criminals and on ocassion, shoot them and then the parents who never really parented their kid are pissed their little Tookie took a bullet because he never does anything wrong.

Current Example - At the behest of the DPD, DPS troopers have been patrolling in the Fair Park area. There has been a 30% drop in crime but the community and the DA as its mouthpiece is now clamoring for the troopers to leave. The city of E. Pittsburgh did away with their police force after a white officer shot and killed a young black man (that officer was charged but found innocent by a jury). That same community is now pissed that crime is up and deputies don't patrol their community often enough. Duh.

Getting back to this incident. The officer did not make a poor decision if indeed the dog was advancing to attack. He had poor marksmanship on a moving target (there is a difference). Nowhere did I say he should not be held responsible. I just see a lot of detractors here making assumptions on stuff they don't know about. I could care less about the ATF FBI jokes. I have a sense of humor too but to imply the officer routinely looks to violate the civil liberties of others is spoken out of ignorance and bias. Again, we all have opinions and I am just expressing mine. Change my mind if you want to discuss further.

After reading the WFAA story it appears to be a Lab mix of some sort. I have had 2 dogs attempt to bite me (not on duty) A cocker spaniel and you guessed it a Lab. Meanwhile my pit mix in 10 years has never even acted like she is gonna bite someone. She'll probably flip any second now..... Maybe the dog was protecting its owner? I'd like to know why the woman, a daughter of a Fire Captain, was out there and if she was unconscious. Maybe if she controlled her dog she would still be alive and a young officer would not have a ruined career.

 

[BillFairbanks]

It is harder on the average LEO than ever before but it isn't because police actions (generally) have eroded the trust. The same people the police usually contact on a daily basis are easily compared to supporters of the left, antifa, and BLM - criminals. You are never going to get the trust of these people. The people that do trust LE generally have very little contact with them. That trust erodes when you have story after story painting LEOs in a negative light. Those meida stories are short on facts and big on assumptions. These same people that trusted LE start to question LE actions (perhaps you are one of them). Throw in the fact that so many have 0 inkling of what goes on in police work and well it makes it worse.

the ideas of the IACP and community policing brought on by the public demanding something be done and citizen review boards and Chiefs and Sheriffs wanting to keep their positions have made most agencies kinder and gentler. You see those stories all the time - Sgt. in Uniform playing Basketball with youths, Cops installing a window unit for seniors, donut breakfasts in poorer communities. It's all BS. What you want is your uniform patrol force going out and being pro active in stopping crime. The problem is they arrest these thugs and POS criminals and on ocassion, shoot them and then the parents who never really parented their kid are pissed their little Tookie took a bullet because he never does anything wrong.

Current Example - At the behest of the DPD, DPS troopers have been patrolling in the Fair Park area. There has been a 30% drop in crime but the community and the DA as its mouthpiece is now clamoring for the troopers to leave. The city of E. Pittsburgh did away with their police force after a white officer shot and killed a young black man (that officer was charged but found innocent by a jury). That same community is now pissed that crime is up and deputies don't patrol their community often enough. Duh.

Getting back to this incident. The officer did not make a poor decision if indeed the dog was advancing to attack. He had poor marksmanship on a moving target (there is a difference). Nowhere did I say he should not be held responsible. I just see a lot of detractors here making assumptions on stuff they don't know about. I could care less about the ATF FBI jokes. I have a sense of humor too but to imply the officer routinely looks to violate the civil liberties of others is spoken out of ignorance and bias. Again, we all have opinions and I am just expressing mine. Change my mind if you want to discuss further.

After reading the WFAA story it appears to be a Lab mix of some sort. I have had 2 dogs attempt to bite me (not on duty) A cocker spaniel and you guessed it a Lab. Meanwhile my pit mix in 10 years has never even acted like she is gonna bite someone. She'll probably flip any second now..... Maybe the dog was protecting its owner? I'd like to know why the woman, a daughter of a Fire Captain, was out there and if she was unconscious. Maybe if she controlled her dog she would still be alive and a young officer would not have a ruined career.

The people upset about the DPS in South Dallas are mad because they are criminals. The Democrat Party has openly become the criminal party. I don’t know how cops in anti police cities go to work everyday.

As for the dog’s behavior. Running aggressively and barking doesn’t mean it’s going to bite. How do departments train officers to handle dogs who appear aggressive? I’ve had dogs run at me like that and I’ve stood my ground and it wasn’t a problem. I have also been bit though.




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[DoubleDuty]

I watched the video on the news. The dog was on the sidewalk in firing line of the woman. He should not have shot at the dog. Know what your target is and what is behind it rule.

 

[Sublime]

As for the dog’s behavior. Running aggressively and barking doesn’t mean it’s going to bite. How do departments train officers to handle dogs who appear aggressive? I’ve had dogs run at me like that and I’ve stood my ground and it wasn’t a problem. I have also been bit though.




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I am not certain but I thought TCOLE had a class for dealing with dogs. Doubt it is mandatory though. After so many mentally ill people were getting shot, TCOLE did come out with a mandatory class on dealing with the mentally ill. Of course they mandate a class on cultural diversity so you take it for what it is worth.



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