Houston police: 4 officers wounded, 2 of 3 suspects dead

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  • sharkey

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    Interesting .....

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/abc13....e-after-deadly-drug-raid-hpd-warrant/5127653/

    "Another problem? There is nothing in the returned warrant showing heroin, or paraphernalia related to heroin.

    "There's nothing identified in search warrant return as scales or baggies, or anything that would be used to distribute heroin or any other drugs for that matter," Zuniga said.

    As for the gram of cocaine and 18 grams of marijuana found, Zuniga said, "It's not the amount of drugs that would be associated with distribution. I think in this case the officer probably relied on an unreliable informant."

    The same reporters that can't tell a semi auto rifle from an assault rifle are the same ones that don't understand criminal law. Is it really a problem that they didn't find a specific contraband listed in the warrant but found other contraband? We also seem to be getting stuck on the amount too. Do you have a gram of coke and 18g of MJ at your house? Wait, don't answer that.

    Perhaps the case officer relied on an unreliable CI? I guess they won't use him/her again huh? The problem I see with that is the whole thing started with a neighbor complaining. I already asked but I will ask again - What is HPD Narcotics suppose to do with the complaint? Ignore it? Check the tax rolls and run a TCIC/NCIC check on the owner? They got no record so we'll tell the complainant too bad so sad? I mean it's not like other people could reside there right? They did the logical thing and sent a CI to the house and according to the affidavit, the CI made a buy. Now the ball is rolling and off to the judge you go with the PC for the warrant. You don't stop the ball rolling downhill if you want to send cases to the DA and show your unit supervisor you aren't sitting on your a**.

    Did the neighbor get it wrong? Maybe they were just users and not sellers though they did sell to the CI (if the CI was being truthful). The next Q would be - What does the CI get out of it from lying? I imagine that is what IA and OIS is trying to determine rather than just looking at the warrant service and saying the cops screwed up because 2 people with no CH are dead and we just found a lil' contraband.
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    V-Tach

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    He is saying the same thing you are.....

    I am not "ignorant" I am educated on the subject...

    With just a little effort it could have been known that these two weren't major players....

    Not all drug users deserve to die.....not all drug users need to be arrested.

    jmho....

    I will add, we benefit from living in a small town. The majority of our bad players are known and are frequent flyers. I have no sympathy for those who kill themselves with drugs. But I also don't think it's necessary for every damn warrant to be served as a no knock warrant/raid which puts people like my Son ( and you) in a more dangerous situation than is necessary.
     
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    V-Tach

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    Are we winning the "war on drugs" in any measurable way?

    The honest answer is.....no...

    How long do we keep doing the same thing without success before we look at alternative ways of dealing with it?

    I don't have all the answers, I don't pretend to know everything....

    I do know enough that when something doesn't work in my life I need to change and adapt to achieve my goals..
     

    leVieux

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    Are we winning the "war on drugs" in any measure?

    Not all drug users deserve to die.....not all drug users need to be arrested.

    jmho....

    Let me disagree:

    As a young Physician in South Texas, I worked in this area long ago.

    "Recreational Users" provide the hard currency which fuels the entire illegal drug trade.

    Many of these are otherwise responsible, law-abiding citizens; including young lawyers, government employees, dentists, even cops and physicians.

    These see their crimes as "cute" and not harming anyone.

    But that is NOT TRUE !

    Their cash enables the entire system to continue. They rarely see the massive "collateral damage" or extended criminal enterprises they are funding.

    I do not propose imprisoning these criminal accessories; but they should be arrested and fined heavily. They need to be FORCED to pay for at least some of the human misery which results from THEIR CRIMES.

    Unless and until this is done, any "War on Drugs" is just a sham !

    leVieux
     

    V-Tach

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    Well that's an option that should be explored........

    Like I stated earlier, don't have the answers......but it is time to revisit and discuss the failure of our current policies.........and alternatives/modifications to achieve our goal of less drugs, less crime....less loss of life on both sides.........Better border control is definitely needed........

    Sure no knocks are warranted....sometimes.....sure some folks need to go to jail......

    It's like when a good guy with a gun does something good, we rarely hear about it....when a good guy does something stupid with a gun...everyone hears about it....which thankfully is rare....

    When no knock warrants go bad...same thing.....but I sure hear about a hell of a lot of them not ending well... nation wide......
     

    pronstar

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    The same reporters that can't tell a semi auto rifle from an assault rifle are the same ones that don't understand criminal law. Is it really a problem that they didn't find a specific contraband listed in the warrant but found other contraband? We also seem to be getting stuck on the amount too. Do you have a gram of coke and 18g of MJ at your house? Wait, don't answer that.

    Perhaps the case officer relied on an unreliable CI? I guess they won't use him/her again huh? The problem I see with that is the whole thing started with a neighbor complaining. I already asked but I will ask again - What is HPD Narcotics suppose to do with the complaint? Ignore it? Check the tax rolls and run a TCIC/NCIC check on the owner? They got no record so we'll tell the complainant too bad so sad? I mean it's not like other people could reside there right? They did the logical thing and sent a CI to the house and according to the affidavit, the CI made a buy. Now the ball is rolling and off to the judge you go with the PC for the warrant. You don't stop the ball rolling downhill if you want to send cases to the DA and show your unit supervisor you aren't sitting on your a**.

    Did the neighbor get it wrong? Maybe they were just users and not sellers though they did sell to the CI (if the CI was being truthful). The next Q would be - What does the CI get out of it from lying? I imagine that is what IA and OIS is trying to determine rather than just looking at the warrant service and saying the cops screwed up because 2 people with no CH are dead and we just found a lil' contraband.

    So the protocol is:
    1. Neighbor complains
    2. Heroin addict informant say yup
    3. No knock warrant served with heavily armed entry team

    C’mon man...the bar for a no-knock has to be higher than that.


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    toddnjoyce

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    I still think a clerk screwed up and put the wrong address on the affidavit.

    While I believe HPD has released the 8 Jan initial call, I haven’t listened to it or seen a transcript.

    HPDs statement that the location served is the location in the warrant is factually correct, though.
     

    pronstar

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    While I believe HPD has released the 8 Jan initial call, I haven’t listened to it or seen a transcript.

    HPDs statement that the location served is the location in the warrant is factually correct, though.

    If it’s true that the UC who was relieved of duty lied to obtain the warrant, then it casts a shadow of doubt on any facts presented, methinks...


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    toddnjoyce

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    If it’s true that the UC who was relieved of duty lied to obtain the warrant, then it casts a shadow of doubt on any facts presented, methinks...


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    I’m not implying that. I’m curious if the case agent that hasn’t been interviewed yet is the submitter or the warrant.

    Lots of info still to be gathered.
     

    popper

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    Problem with no-knocks is they are set up by those with 'storm the Bastille' attitudes. Any resistance will be severely dealt with. Often forces a undesired response. Yes, I had one in my neighborhood, done early morn. when the kids were walking to the bus stops. Flash bang and DPD, locals just did traffic control. Plan is sneak up during the dark when you have the element of surprise? The time when a response is MOST likely!!.
     

    sharkey

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    So the protocol is:
    1. Neighbor complains
    2. Heroin addict informant say yup
    3. No knock warrant served with heavily armed entry team

    C’mon man...the bar for a no-knock has to be higher than that.


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    Was PC obtained? #3 seems in conflict with you'll. Was it a heavily armed entry team or just guys with gun in "plain clothes"?
    Other than using a CI to make a controlled buy, what would be your suggestion to obtain PC to obtain a warrant?
    Again, the couple did not die because they used weed and Coke but rather because they challenged the entry team. Now I don't advocate shooting your fellow officers but IF that did happen, how does that relate to the couple challenging the officers?



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