My Legislative Wish List

[MR Redneck]

Your definition of a "shall issue state" is incorrect. Texas is a shall issue state.

Whats important to me is how the States issue the " Shall Issue".

 

[APatriot]

The second amendment states that our right to bear arms shall not be infringed. Open carry of handguns is bearing arms.

However, to me, "Constitutional carry" would also involve elimination of all criminal empowerment zones and any sort of licensing requirements.

CC of handguns is bearing arms. I have a CHL so is my right to bear arms being infringed? I also can purchase firearms. Without a CHL, I can have a firearm concealed in my vehicle and inside my home.

I could argue that restricting where I can CC is infringing upon my right, but that is not the issue here.

Your opinion as to elimination of zones and licensing is strictly your opinion, not supported by the 2A.

School is in session. Next?

 

[APatriot]

Whats important to me is how the States issue the " Shall Issue".

Your cartoon is ridiculous since you have the right to bear arms in your vehicle, even without a license.

Next?

 

[TexasRedneck]

Neither OC or CC is specified in the 2A. I am not the one making the "jump" that absent OC we are deprived of our 2A rights. The OC enthusiasts, which I suspect you are one, make that claim. But please, if you wish to engage in "verbal judo", please don't answer a question with a question.

Then let me put in in plain English: "....the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

TELL me where it says "as long as they're out of sight". My personal views on OC vs CC are not germain to the issue at hand - the question is where the right of the state to restrict my exercise of my 2nd Amendment rights. Scum can protest at the funerals of service members killed in service to this country - and you think it's okay to restrict MY rights???
Remember that absent authority, any rights are reserved to the citizenry, NOT to the state.

 

[TexasRedneck]

Your opinion as to elimination of zones and licensing is strictly your opinion, not supported by the 2A.

School is in session. Next?

Show me where they have the authority to restrict same.

We need another teacher - you ain't cuttin' the mustard.

 

[APatriot]

Then let me put in in plain English: "....the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

TELL me where it says "as long as they're out of sight". My personal views on OC vs CC are not germain to the issue at hand - the question is where the right of the state to restrict my exercise of my 2nd Amendment rights. Scum can protest at the funerals of service members killed in service to this country - and you think it's okay to restrict MY rights???
Remember that absent authority, any rights are reserved to the citizenry, NOT to the state.

The 2A simply says the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. It doesn't address CC or OC. Therefore, CC and/or OC = right to bear arms. Again, the state is restricting my right when it restricts where I can carry my concealed firearm. That is the real debate. The anti-gun folks love it when OC is the issue, so they can resort to name calling: "gun right whackos".

 

[APatriot]

Show me where they have the authority to restrict same.

We need another teacher - you ain't cuttin' the mustard.

The 2A simply states the right to keep and bear arms. Is my right being satisfied via CC? BTW, if the subject matter is too hard simply drop the class.

 

[TexasRedneck]

The 2A simply says the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. It doesn't address CC or OC. Therefore, CC and/or OC = right to bear arms. Again, the state is restricting my right when it restricts where I can carry my concealed firearm. That is the real debate. The anti-gun folks love it when OC is the issue, so they can resort to name calling: "gun right whackos".

No, sir - you are wrong. If I wish to open carry and am precluded from doing so, then it is restricting me from exercise of my rights, just as it is when someone tries to keep someone from burning a US flag as a protest. When are we going to finally realize that OUR rights are every bit as precious as the other 9?!?? I frankly don't give a tinkers damn WHAT the anti-gun types think - I've watched far too many of our rights erode as folks such as yourself try to "justify" the infringement of same.

 

[TexasRedneck]

Is my right being satisfied via CC? BTW, if the subject matter is too hard simply drop the class.

No, because you're having to PAY to exercise that "right" - that's no longer a right, but a privelege. When confronted with incompetent teachers, I prefer to replace them....

 

[APatriot]

No, sir - you are wrong. If I wish to open carry and am precluded from doing so, then it is restricting me from exercise of my rights, just as it is when someone tries to keep someone from burning a US flag as a protest. When are we going to finally realize that OUR rights are every bit as precious as the other 9?!?? I frankly don't give a tinkers damn WHAT the anti-gun types think - I've watched far too many of our rights erode as folks such as yourself try to "justify" the infringement of same.

I am only wrong in your opinion, which is ok. Again, where does the 2A address OC, or even CC for that matter. Again, am I bearing arms when I CC? Again, am I bearing arms when I have a concealed firearm in my vehicle or in my home? Simple questions.

 

[MR Redneck]

Gun Control in Texas began with the ratification of the 14th amendment. Texas Legislature amended the Texs constitution to justify the infringement on the 14th amendment.
Nothing in the 2nd amendment or in the other 26 amendments allows States to charge for exercising your rights. Nothing in the Constitution specifically allows state to restrict the rights of honest citizens.
Restrictions should only be applied to criminals.

"Besides the advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation... Notwithstanding the military establishments in the several kingdoms of Europe, which are carried as far as the public resources will bear, the governments are afraid to trust the people with arms." - James Madison, Federalist Papers, #46 at 243-244

"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." - Thomas Jefferson

NEXT!

 

[APatriot]

No, because you're having to PAY to exercise that "right" - that's no longer a right, but a privelege. When confronted with incompetent teachers, I prefer to replace them....

Where does a "right" stipulate a fee or non-fee based proposition?

 

[TexasRedneck]

I am only wrong in your opinion, which is ok. Again, where does the 2A address OC, or even CC for that matter. Again, am I bearing arms when I CC? Again, am I bearing arms when I have a concealed firearm in my vehicle or in my home? Simple questions.

<sigh> Sometimes, when arguing with someone that won't listen it simply isn't worth the effort. You call yourself a patriot, and from what I've read you're anything but. Because if you think that by allowing someone else to determine when and how you may exercise your rights is acceptable, you've got much to learn before attempting to think you can teach others.
I've quoted you direct from the source - and you keep trying to ignore that. FYI, since you apparently can't be bothered to look it up....

"Infringed" - Act so as to limit or undermine (something); encroach on

 

[APatriot]

Gun Control in Texas began with the ratification of the 14th amendment. Texas Legislature amended the Texs constitution to justify the infringement on the 14th amendment.
Nothing in the 2nd amendment or in the other 26 amendments allows States to charge for exercising your rights. Nothing in the Constitution specifically allows state to restrict the rights of honest citizens.
Restrictions should only be applied to criminals.

"Besides the advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation... Notwithstanding the military establishments in the several kingdoms of Europe, which are carried as far as the public resources will bear, the governments are afraid to trust the people with arms." - James Madison, Federalist Papers, #46 at 243-244

"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." - Thomas Jefferson

NEXT!

Next would be nice in regard to answering my questions.

BTW, "Nothing in the 2nd amendment or in the other 26 amendments" prohibits "States to charge for exercising your rights".

 

[TexasRedneck]

Where does a "right" stipulate a fee or non-fee based proposition?

I refer you to the finding of the US Supreme Court, which held that "Poll Taxes" were, in fact, an impediment to the poor in exercising their right to vote.

Have a seat right over there....YOUR teacher is here to help!

 

[APatriot]

<sigh> You call yourself a patriot, and from what I've read you're anything but.

ok

 

[APatriot]

I refer you to the finding of the US Supreme Court, which held that "Poll Taxes" were, in fact, an impediment to the poor in exercising their right to vote.

Have a seat right over there....YOUR teacher is here to help!

Based on recent elections, poll taxes probably would have kept Obama out of office. Again, where does a "right" stipulate a fee or non-fee based proposition in regard to 2A? I know, you and the other student consistently avoid answering the questions because it would be "check mate" and you know it. Again, I believe the pro-gun movement is being ill-served by focusing on OC because some may not "qualify" for a CHL, or simply have a degree of inferiority and wish to resort to the "John Wayne syndrome" - look at me, I am a tough guy with a gun for everyone to see and make me feel important...lol

 

[MR Redneck]

I am only wrong in your opinion, which is ok. Again, where does the 2A address OC, or even CC for that matter. Again, am I bearing arms when I CC? Again, am I bearing arms when I have a concealed firearm in my vehicle or in my home? Simple questions.

It doesnt say you cant.
To relate to this Constitionality issue lets look at State Constitutions.
New Mexico; Constitutional Open Carry State.


New Mexico: No law shall abridge the right of the citizen to keep and bear arms for security and defense, for lawful hunting and recreational use and for other lawful purposes, but nothing herein shall be held to permit the carrying of concealed weapons. No municipality or county shall regulate, in any way, an incident of the right to keep and bear arms. Art. II, § 6 (first sentence enacted in 1971, second sentence added 1986).
1912: "The people have the right to bear arms for their security and defense, but nothing herein shall be held to permit the carrying of concealed weapons." Art. II, § 6. [Self-defense right explicitly protected.]

Arizona; Constitutional Open Carry State.
The right of the individual citizen to bear arms in defense of himself or the State shall not be impaired, but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain, or employ an armed body of men. Art. II, § 26 (enacted 1912).

Wisconsin; Constitutional Open Carry state
The people have the right to keep and bear arms for security, defense, hunting, recreation or any other lawful purpose. Art. I, § 25 (enacted 1998).
[Self-defense right protected, State v. Fisher, 714 N.W.2d 495 (Wisc. 2006).]

Now lets look at Texas;

Texas: Every citizen shall have the right to keep and bear arms in the lawful defense of himself or the State; but the Legislature shall have power, by law, to regulate the wearing of arms, with a view to prevent crime. Art. I, § 23 (enacted 1876).
1836: "Every citizen shall have the right to bear arms in defence of himself and the republic. The military shall at all times and in all cases be subordinate to the civil power." Declaration of Rights, cl. 14.
1845: "Every citizen shall have the right to keep and bear arms in lawful defence of himself or the State." Art. I, § 13.
1868: "Every person shall have the right to keep and bear arms in the lawful defence of himself or the State, under such regulations as the legislature may prescribe." Art. I, § 13.
The Legislative act of 1868 was the infringement! Abuse of power to prevent Freedmen the 14th amendment right, ratified in 1868!

 

[APatriot]

Let's all focus on expanding where we can CC.

 

[APatriot]

It doesnt say you cant.
To relate to this Constitionality issue lets look at State Constitutions.
New Mexico; Constitutional Open Carry State.


New Mexico: No law shall abridge the right of the citizen to keep and bear arms for security and defense, for lawful hunting and recreational use and for other lawful purposes, but nothing herein shall be held to permit the carrying of concealed weapons. No municipality or county shall regulate, in any way, an incident of the right to keep and bear arms. Art. II, § 6 (first sentence enacted in 1971, second sentence added 1986).
1912: "The people have the right to bear arms for their security and defense, but nothing herein shall be held to permit the carrying of concealed weapons." Art. II, § 6. [Self-defense right explicitly protected.]

Arizona; Constitutional Open Carry State.
The right of the individual citizen to bear arms in defense of himself or the State shall not be impaired, but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain, or employ an armed body of men. Art. II, § 26 (enacted 1912).

Wisconsin; Constitutional Open Carry state
The people have the right to keep and bear arms for security, defense, hunting, recreation or any other lawful purpose. Art. I, § 25 (enacted 1998).
[Self-defense right protected, State v. Fisher, 714 N.W.2d 495 (Wisc. 2006).]

Now lets look at Texas;

Texas: Every citizen shall have the right to keep and bear arms in the lawful defense of himself or the State; but the Legislature shall have power, by law, to regulate the wearing of arms, with a view to prevent crime. Art. I, § 23 (enacted 1876).
1836: "Every citizen shall have the right to bear arms in defence of himself and the republic. The military shall at all times and in all cases be subordinate to the civil power." Declaration of Rights, cl. 14.
1845: "Every citizen shall have the right to keep and bear arms in lawful defence of himself or the State." Art. I, § 13.
1868: "Every person shall have the right to keep and bear arms in the lawful defence of himself or the State, under such regulations as the legislature may prescribe." Art. I, § 13.
The Legislative act of 1868 was the infringement! Abuse of power to prevent Freedmen the 14th amendment right, ratified in 1868!

Again, am I bearing arms when I CC? Again, am I bearing arms when I have a concealed firearm in my vehicle or in my home? Simple questions.