The SLIDE FIRE

[Marlowe]

I find the difference in the ability to control the weapon much better with the Slide Fire. Using only your finger while in a shouldered position and bump firing results in no grip, resulting in less weapon control. With the Slide Fire the grip remains on your hand, resulting in better control of the weapon. Didn't you find the grip remaining in your hand to be better for controlling the weapon when you used it?

Same trigger, same action, same physics, all agreed... And that is why it will not be banned in my, and so far the ATF's, opinion.

The forearm is effectively your controlling grip in either: there's really not much difference in control between no grip and one that's flopping around a half an inch in relation to the rest of the rifle. As far as a ban or not, you may be right, but when is the last time the ATF let something like this slide for long?

 

[SidewaysTA]

Have any citations or evidence of either of your claims? Or is this just your opinion?
Being able to "go cyclic" is not quite the same as controlled accurate fire.

bump fire 9mm ar15 - YouTube

 

[Wolfwood]

"kindof an expensive hobby"

very awesome

 

[macshooter]

The slide fire is, in actuality, absolutely nothing but a piece of plastic that replaces much of the learning curve for bump firing. There's methods of "unassisted" bump firing that are just as "controlled" as any plastic gimmick-enhanced method; it's not all just the redneck with a belt loop method.... If you're good at bump firing with the gun in a standard "aimed" position, you aren't going to improve a bit by dropping a bunch of money on the latest geegaw... It may be an improvement upon some of your more crude methods, but it's not an improvement on the basic process of bump firing: it's still the same trigger, the same action, the same physics.

You are obviously a genius, and we are all fortunate to have you around to enlighten us. Maybe next you can post up some vids of you demonstrating some advanced________methods.

 

[Charlie]

I b t l !

 

[TxDad]

I B T L l

+1

 

[Clockwork]

advanced ______ methods.

IBTL!

 

[FlashBang]

The forearm is effectively your controlling grip in either: there's really not much difference in control between no grip and one that's flopping around a half an inch in relation to the rest of the rifle. As far as a ban or not, you may be right, but when is the last time the ATF let something like this slide for long?

Let me see if I understand your statement here: You are saying that controlling the weapon with one hand on the fore stock, no hold on the pistol grip and only your finger being used to bump fire with by allowing the recoil to move the weapon rearwards and your fore stock hold to then pull it forward gives better control then having a grip on both the fore stock AND the pistol grip as when using the Slide Fire? You seem to also be saying that the Slide Fire allows the weapon to "flop around a half inch"... is your Slide Fire doing this? Mine is a straight smooth forward and back reciprocating action with no up/down/sideways "flop". Perhaps there is something wrong with yours?

I would also question the statement that the "The forearm is effectively your controlling grip in either", the forearm is the controlling grip only for the forward movement and is coupled 50/50 with the rear grip for control of the weapon and accuracy. The rear grip is just as critical in controlling any weapon; if this were not the case then even bench shooters would not rely on the pistol grip of the weapon for control and accuracy. Many bench shooters I know will rest the fore stock on sandbags or similar while using the rear pistol grip to provide control for accuracy. I haven't seen any who hold only the fore stock, then rest the rear of the stock on a sandbag and only use a finger to pull the trigger.

Banning it would most likely require that the ATF also make it illegal to use your finger to bump fire a weapon as this is exactly what you are doing when you use a Slide Fire or Bumpski stock. The shooter uses their finger to effectively pull the trigger for each shot fired. You are in effect simply increasing the speed at which this can be done and providing a better grip for control.

 

[FlashBang]

bump fire 9mm ar15 - YouTube

Good example and I will agree that some people may be able to do it without a bumpfire stock. However, the stock makes it easier to do so for many people. Again, if you don't like them don't buy them. What others do with their money is up to them.

 

[FlashBang]

"kindof an expensive hobby"

very awesome

Just buying firearms and collecting is kind of an expensive hobby isn't it?

 

[FlashBang]

@MacShooter : I don't think that was appropriate. He is simply expressing his opinion, doesn't mean his is the only one, but it doesn't mean he is not entitled to share his views either. I may not have to agree with him, but I'd still go to the range with him and enjoy shooting with him as another gun enthusiast in the TGT family.

 

[macshooter]

Give me a break.

There are other ways to express your opinion than to come on here and basically call anyone with a slidefire stock a moron who is just too stupid to understand how to bumpfire, and then proceed to give us a lecture about it. That's douchebag move.

I'm always open to a civil debate, but if you start off being rude, then you can expect the same rudeness from me in return. Being civil doesn't mean being respectful of the opinion of a douchebag who has gone out of the way to be rude and disrespectful to you from the start. That's not being civil, that's being an ass-wipe. You can respect the troll's opinion if you like. I'll pass.

In the interest of not getting this thread locked down, I will also pass on any further comments about/from the troll.

 

[Clockwork]

Give me a break.

There are other ways to express your opinion than to come on here and basically call anyone with a slidefire stock a moron who is just too stupid to understand how to bumpfire, and then proceed to give us a lecture about it. That's douchebag move.

I'm always open to a civil debate, but if you start off being rude, then you can expect the same rudeness from me in return. Being civil doesn't mean being respectful of the opinion of a douchebag who has gone out of the way to be rude and disrespectful to you from the start. That's not being civil, that's being an ass-wipe. You can respect the troll's opinion if you like. I'll pass.

In the interest of not getting this thread locked down, I will also pass on any further comments about/from the troll.

We all have different interests in firearms. I myself know I'm a pretty shitty shooter and have a lot of core fundamentals that I need to work on to get better in that regard but I love guns from a technological perspective. I eat up things like this slide fire (which I've never heard of before this topic). Hell, I own a Nagant M1895 gas seal revolver simply for the fact that it is a unique little piece of firearms technology. I haven't even shot it!

A love of firearms is not one cookie-cutter set of interests nor are the peole that own them, so theres never any reason to look down on somebody for using something that they feel makes their hobby more fun.

 

[TxDad]

So using that method you pointed out machshooter, this is going to turn into a "He started it" conversation that has progressed to name calling?

 

[macshooter]

I'll be the first to admit the slidefire is ridiculously overpriced for what it is (the materials are maybe $10 worth of plastic), but you have to factor in the risk the owner of the company took bring a product like that to market, where others have been slapped down by the ATF. The Akins Accellerator for example, which was nearly the same, except it has a spring in the stock that ATF said made it a machinegun. ATF slapped down Bill (I think that's his name) Akins' stock, and his whole company and all the time and effort he put into it went down the drain. However he does own a patent for the sliding movement of the stock, and from what I understand, the owner of Slidefire pays him royalties to be able to manufacture it. So that factors into the cost as well. Then you can compare it to what it would cost to own an M16 ($15,000 - $20,000), and $350 doesn't seem that bad for what it does. Using the slidefire is effortless, about as close to flipping a switch as you'll ever get without a stamp, and you can grip the stock normally, and push the stock against your shoulder firmly which means better aim.

They probably will ban it at some point. But I wish I was one of the 'stupid' guys who bought a bunch of MG's before the '86 ban or polytech and norinco AKs before the 94 AWB. Those guys were real morons... Typically when ATF bans something, they don't confiscate it, they require you to register it within a certain period of time, and after that the limited supply of them causes prices for them to go through the roof.

 

[SidewaysTA]

Good example and I will agree that some people may be able to do it without a bumpfire stock. However, the stock makes it easier to do so for many people. Again, if you don't like them don't buy them. What others do with their money is up to them.

I can agree with that. The stock does make it easier and I would probably get one if they weren't so darn expensive.

I just remembered seeing that video and it came to mind when you asked for proof in your previous posting.

Mike

 

[Acera]

Still waiting on the Koreans or Chinese to make and import their version of it. If the past is any indication, prices should be in the $50- $75 range and I will pick one up then.

+1 on it being ridiculously overpriced based on materials.

 

[FlashBang]

I own a Nagant M1895 gas seal revolver simply for the fact that it is a unique little piece of firearms technology. I haven't even shot it!

Not to go off topic, I have the M1895 also and am looking at getting several more. They are $99.00, hold 7 rounds, and the supply of them is running low. As a gas seal revolver they are also the only revolver ( to my knowledge ) that can actually be suppressed. I'm think of having the barrel threaded on 1 or 2 and suppressing them. Why? Because I want to and I can.

 

[macshooter]

Still waiting on the Koreans or Chinese to make and import their version of it. If the past is any indication, prices should be in the $50- $75 range and I will pick one up then.

Yup. I would buy one FAST though when those hit the market because as soon as they do, I think a ban is right around the corner. I was going to wait for that myself, but then if there's a quality issue or some kink that needed to get ironed out with them, I don't think they will make it to version 2.0 before a ban hits. Sadly it's only a matter of time before some gangsta thug does something stupid with one and we all pay the price.

 

[FlashBang]

Still waiting on the Koreans or Chinese to make and import their version of it. If the past is any indication, prices should be in the $50- $75 range and I will pick one up then.

+1 on it being ridiculously overpriced based on materials.

No argument from me on wanting to see a lower price. If they were $50 I'd order another 10 today just to have them on hand.