widespread price-gouging

[Kyle]

How much of a markup does it take to be gouging? Yes the guy charging 400% is price gouging but is there any dollar amount or percentage someone could add to the ammo they bought in the store and it still be a fair price or are we against all buying for the sake of reselling?

If we are justifying what these guys are doing as "capitalism" then yes, I am against purchasing a product with the intent to resell for a profit, unless you have a business license. I have to have one to own a business. Why are they immune from what I have to go through to make a living?

 

[Southpaw]

Try telling someone who think's they will never see another another .223 cartridge in their life time to just "be without". If people weren't prone to panic, that would be the logical way to stop the nonsense.

I guess you just can't fix crazy or stupid!!!

 

[Kyle]

I guess you just can't fix crazy or stupid!!!

If people would make the choice to be honest, we wouldn't have half the problems that we do.

 

[Renegade]

Actually I know one difference. They put the guy selling ice in jail for price gauging

Which is why I will never sell my stocks during a disaster, even if it is below cost to me.

 

[Texas42]

If we are justifying what these guys are doing as "capitalism" then yes, I am against purchasing a product with the intent to resell for a profit, unless you have a business license. I have to have one to own a business. Why are they immune from what I have to go through to make a living?

It doesn't change the fact. The demand for .22lr ammo FAR outpaces supply right now. If no one was "gouging," there would be NO ammo for sale.

If you don't like the prices, don't buy. Its called a transaction. No one is forcing you to buy. That is why everyone says "thank-you" in a transaction. You want the goods more than the money, they want the money more than the goods. If either parties are not satisfied, then the transaction doesn't happen.

We'd all be happier if we didn't have Obama as president or a democratic majority is the Senate, we didn't have a Sandy Hook or Columbine or other mass shooting every few months. But this is reality.

This whole, "I could buy a lot more ammo if everyone else just stopped buying it. After all, the world revolves around me" threads that pop up every few weeks are not helpful. Just annoying.

 

[beavf16]

There's a lot more liberals on this site than I expected.

 

[Kyle]

It doesn't change the fact. The demand for .22lr ammo FAR outpaces supply right now. If no one was "gouging," there would be NO ammo for sale.

If you don't like the prices, don't buy. Its called a transaction. No one is forcing you to buy. That is why everyone says "thank-you" in a transaction. You want the goods more than the money, they want the money more than the goods. If either parties are not satisfied, then the transaction doesn't happen.

We'd all be happier if we didn't have Obama as president or a democratic majority is the Senate, we didn't have a Sandy Hook or Columbine or other mass shooting every few months. But this is reality.

This whole, "I could buy a lot more ammo if everyone else just stopped buying it. After all, the world revolves around me" threads that pop up every few weeks are not helpful. Just annoying.

Who said anything like "I could buy more ammo if..."? The problem is that no one buy ammo unless they want to give Joe Blow 300% over what he paid hours, sometimes minutes earlier.

As far as .22 being gouged because it is gone... It is STILL the same people doing it. They purchased the stuff that was on the shelves with the sole purpose of resale at a profit... without a business license... at insane prices... which a licensed business could get into trouble for doing.


If I as a business have to abide by these laws, what exempts everyone else? what makes it ok? If you are purchasing products with the intent to resell for a profit, you need a business license.


We all sell our personal things here and there and at a profit occasionally and that is all fine and dandy... but this is so over the top and painfully dishonest that it is hard to keep quiet about it.

I don't need the ammo, I have enough for what I use and I certainly am not going to sell it off to anyone for more than I paid. Ill buy it as I need it. I have no personal bone to pick here. I have not been subjected to the gouging. I see it happening everywhere though and it is just plain wrong. Nothing more to it unless you want to get into the legal aspects of what they are doing.

 

[Brains]

There's a lot more liberals on this site than I expected.

It's not too surprising, because over the years we've been (society as a whole) indoctrinated into a Wal-Mart society. We want everything, we want it cheap, we want it now, and if we don't want it anymore we want our money back.

 

[beavf16]

I agree with what you're saying Kyle, however I was referring to the pleas for government intervention and the defense of government restrictions on free trade, such as business licensing.

 

[Kyle]

I don't want the gov't restricting us and growing in size any more than any one else who is tired of their shit... But Ill be damned if I have to have a business license to make a small margin on what I am selling, while some random guy who works at lowes goes and makes FARRR more profit than the business he purchased the product from... and he doesn't have to pay taxes on that money either... I certainly can't do that or my butt would be getting probed by some weird prick with a calculator and a gov't badge that says he can end the way I make a living with the stroke of a pen.

 

[Texan2]

Kyle,
Why can't you sell ammo at a 400% markup like this guy you are talking about? You have a business license. You can aquire stock just like he does. There is no law that restricts how much you can mark up ammo.

No "weird prick" with a govt badge is going to investigate you for selling ammo at a huge mark up.

 

[beavf16]

I don't want the gov't restricting us and growing in size any more than any one else who is tired of their shit... But Ill be damned if I have to have a business license to make a small margin on what I am selling, while some random guy who works at lowes goes and makes FARRR more profit than the business he purchased the product from... and he doesn't have to pay taxes on that money either... I certainly can't do that or my butt would be getting probed by some weird prick with a calculator and a gov't badge that says he can end the way I make a living with the stroke of a pen.

You want it more tgan the guy buying and selling ammo.

 

[Texan2]

might as well be blowing smoke up someone's rear. Look at this post, for example...
SMALL PISTOL PRIMERS 1000pcs CCI no.500 BRICK : Reloading Supplies at GunBroker.com

$10 shipping. No hazmat. Cost legit buisness owners $27.50 plus $4.75 adult signature fee to ship within the law (Federal hazardous material transportation law 49 CFR Part 107.333). No one on the fed side gives a crap, reporting or no. Criminals prosper, law abiding citizens take it in the rear by loosing buisness to criminals.

Perhaps this seller just absorbs the actual price of shipping into his sale price and by marketing his wares with a cheaper shipping price lures more buyers to his item?
No one is justifying criminal behavior. This thread was about price gouging, not operating a business without a license or improperly shipping products. If they are doing those things that is a completely different topic.
People can cry all they want about it and can say it isn't capitalism if they so desire, they would merely be wrong. It is. Let's go back to 6th grade economics and review supply/demand.

 

[Texan2]

Ultimately, there is nothing that can really be done about price gouging other than not giving money to people who do it. However, that does not mean price gouging is simply ok either. It is a form of exploitation. Consider that if you are looking to purchase any goods from someone who has put a high mark-up on their merchandise. Do you want that person to exploit YOU?

People may not like it, but I don't see it as an ethical or moral issue. You don't NEED guns and ammo. The market always corrects itself when it gets too far out of whack.

 

[Kyle]

Kyle,
Why can't you sell ammo at a 400% markup like this guy you are talking about? You have a business license. You can aquire stock just like he does. There is no law that restricts how much you can mark up ammo.

No "weird prick" with a govt badge is going to investigate you for selling ammo at a huge mark up.

yes, I have a business license, it is not a matter of can't, it is a matter of shouldn't. My moral compass wouldn't allow me to take advantage of people like that. I wouldn't go to a business that has those mark-ups.

I was referring to not paying taxes when I made that last comment, not marking up ammo.

To purchase a product with the intent to sell at a profit, you need a business license. That is so the gov't gets their slice of the pie... Which is why doing so without a business license is technically illegal.

 

[Kyle]

You want it more tgan the guy buying and selling ammo.

That is because as a business, I have to pay taxes on whatever bit of money I make because I am following the rules.

 

[Texan2]

yes, I have a business license, it is not a matter of can't, it is a matter of shouldn't. My moral compass wouldn't allow me to take advantage of people like that. I wouldn't go to a business that has those mark-ups.

I was referring to not paying taxes when I made that last comment, not marking up ammo.

To purchase a product with the intent to sell at a profit, you need a business license. That is so the gov't gets their slice of the pie... Which is why doing so without a business license is technically illegal.

I see. So your ethical view/business model keeps you from making money. That happens everyday in all kinds of businesses around America. I still don't see how selling them high priced ammo is taking advantage of them. They don't NEED to buy it. They WANT to buy it. If they want it so badly they will pay crazy prices, that is their issue, not yours. Some will pay stupid prices and thank you and think you did them a favor (and you may have).

Case in point:
I was in Mexico last month and paid $30 for a disposable camera that is $7 at Walgreens here in Texas. Why did I do it? Because I was in a tourist area with few options and wanted an underwater camera and I wanted it RIGHT THEN. And at that moment, the price was inconsequential. I wanted some once in a lifetime pics. I paid the crazy price and was glad that someone had a camera to sell me.

You are not always screwing someone just because you are making a big profit.

The tax issue/business license is a completely seperate issue.

 

[Hoji]

There's a lot more liberals on this site than I expected.

You have no idea.

 

[Mexican_Hippie]

Convenience is a value added service. Convenience has a price.

If you don't want to stand in line and do all the work then be prepared to pay a service charge.


Economics 101...most of you would fail.

 

[Kyle]

I see. So your ethical view/business model keeps you from making money. That happens everyday in all kinds of businesses around America. I still don't see how selling them high priced ammo is taking advantage of them. They don't NEED to buy it. They WANT to buy it. If they want it so badly they will pay crazy prices, that is their issue, not yours. Some will pay stupid prices and thank you and think you did them a favor (and you may have).

Case in point:
I was in Mexico last month and paid $30 for a disposable camera that is $7 at Walgreens here in Texas. Why did I do it? Because I was in a tourist area with few options and wanted an underwater camera and I wanted it RIGHT THEN. And at that moment, the price was inconsequential. I wanted some once in a lifetime pics. I paid the crazy price and was glad that someone had a camera to sell me.

You are not always screwing someone just because you are making a big profit.

The tax issue/business license is a completely seperate issue.

They didnt need the ammo either. They chose to buy the ammo to resell at a profit for their own gain to take advantage of someone who thinks they need the ammo.

If you have to be immoral to run a business and make money, then I guess I am just wasting my time and I should go get a job like everyone else. You understand how foolish that first statement is. ethics and morals are all that holds anything together. Once that is gone, there is nothing left.

There is making a profit and then there is gouging. If someone wants to make a couple extra bucks on something they just bought, whether it be convenience of it or just because they can, im cool with that. but when I KNOW you just paid $12 for a box of .223 and you want to sell it to me for $35 because you "stood in line" so I didn't have to... there is something really wrong with that. Hell, Ive bought a used rifle for over retail from a private seller because I couldn't find the rifle new, anywhere else. It was only 10% over retail. No biggie. I was more than happy to have the rifle, he made a little profit. He wasn't out to gouge. Ill pay for convenience to a point. These ammo flippers blew past that point.

The tax issue and business license is a directly related issue. There is a guy in town here who admittedly profited over 3k in ammo he bought and sold... You know what happens if the gov't finds out I didn't report 3k in sales?

Some lady in town here got shut down and fined big time for selling breakfast tacos at construction sights without a business license or a retail food license. Their biggest complaint was that she was not an established business and she was making money which was not being reported, not that she was violating every health code in the book. She was doing these guys a big favor, saving them from running into town to get food. While she was not gouging these guys at all ($3 for a huge taco), she was making a profit from them.

These ammo flippers are doing the same thing, except their markups are MASSIVE.. I doubt people would complain so much if they were selling at a 100% markup... but it is (was) typically far more than that.

We can go back and forth all day about the legalities involved and different examples of what makes it ok, but it simply boils down to, in this particular case, people taking advantage of others who are making a decision based on fear and stress.