Blackhawk SERPA Holsters, simply not worth the risk!

[Combative W]

Here is a great article touching on why the SERPA is one of the most dangerous holsters in my opinion. I know, I know... there are those that say they have used it for years and never had a problem. I always question the extent of "how" it was used when I hear that. Simply put, with what I have seen training people in various classes, I always educate people in that there are much better holsters out there that carry less risk and are of better quality. Glad to see that I am not alone in my thinking as I have been discussing this exact subject for a few years now.

The Point Blank Truth: Blackhawk SERPA Holster Warning

 

[scap99]

Don't need to read it, I tried one in a class for about five minutes before it went back for a refund.
To say I hate them, is being nice. How I really feel about them would get me banned.

The only scarier holster, to me, is the Bianchi 82 Carry Lok.

 

[556.45.12]

It only took me a few Blackhawk product purchases to realize that I don't need any more Blackhawk products. I purchased a SERPA for my XD-45C years ago and never had an issue with it. I rarely used it but never saw shooting myself as an issue. The video in your link of that Tex guy shooting himself in the leg clearly shows his finger on the trigger before the bore was clear of his body - that's totally his fault. It's not the system of rentention that keeps me from using it, it's the feeling of cheapness about it. It feels like a toy holster. But to give Blackhawk a fair shake, it's withstood trips to the range without falling apart on me (yet).

Apparently he was using a 5.11 Thumbdrive holster, not a SERPA:

 

[SIG_Fiend]

Safariland > Blackhawk.

 

[tussery]

This has been covered 1 million times on the internets. I know where I stand, and you won't find me defending the SERPA.

 

[Texanjoker]

The primary issue with them has to do with negligent discharges resulting from sympathetic/residual index finger pressure engaging the trigger immediately after the retention device is defeated with the index/trigger finger.

That quote alone tells me there is an issue with people and where they place their trigger finger. I wear a duty serpa daily with no issues. I also have enough training to know my finger doesn't go on the trigger unless I am engaging a threat. There are many holsters. Find the one best for you.

 

[Jon Payne]

I don't use them. I advise my students not to use them. I have an additional liability release/waiver for students to sign if they decide to use one anyway. No cut downs, no harping, just the way it is.

 

[shortround]

Sad to say some people complain about a product/problem, but don't offer a solution.

OP makes no statement as to which firearm he found the much maligned holster to be defective.

If you have to force a student sign a release for using one brand of holster, then don't allow them to attend your course with that piece of equipment in the first place.

Better to establish tasks, conditions, and standards up front. That way you will never have to wrestle with inferior equipment in the first place.

 

[txinvestigator]

Sad to say some people complain about a product/problem, but don't offer a solution.

OP makes no statement as to which firearm he found the much maligned holster to be defective.

If you have to force a student sign a release for using one brand of holster, then don't allow them to attend your course with that piece of equipment in the first place.

Better to establish tasks, conditions, and standards up front. That way you will never have to wrestle with inferior equipment in the first place.

The solution is don't use the Serpa. For a school, Payne's solution makes sense.

I agree with the OP.

 

[M. Sage]

I still don't see how it's more dangerous.

Idiots who don't know how to draw are going to shoot themselves, no matter what holster. Yeah, I use a SERPA for range and sport. Got it cheap, haven't bothered investing money for a better holster because it suits my needs just fine. Been using it for probably 5 years. Never an issue, but I actually took time to train with it...

 

[txinvestigator]

I still don't see how it's more dangerous.

Idiots who don't know how to draw are going to shoot themselves, no matter what holster. Yeah, I use a SERPA for range and sport. Got it cheap, haven't bothered investing money for a better holster because it suits my needs just fine. Been using it for probably 5 years. Never an issue, but I actually took time to train with it...

As an instructor, I do see how. That is not a judgment on you, though.

It is human nature to be defensive when a product you chose is criticised. People vehemently defend their Bersas, but I have yet to see one, in ten years of instruction, not malfunction. Saturday there were 2 in class. Both had multiple malfunctions, one so severe the student rented a Glock so as to finish without losing too many points. However, people still buy, and some swear by and get defensive of, their Bersas. My criticism of the gun is not a judgment of the person, their intelligence or decision making ability.

Same with these Serpas. And for the record, I purchased one a while back and trained with it. I recognized the issue and destroyed the holster. Didn't even put it in my dead holster drawer.

 

[SIG_Fiend]

The Serpa is just a poor design in general. I mean, if you really need a retention holster, Safariland is pretty much the way to go (ALS or SLS or both). The serpa offers extremely poor retention in that a simple and light bump of the button will easily release the gun. Imagine getting body slammed to the ground and landing on your holster side. Usually with serpas, without the retention of the button, there is little to no other retention on the gun unless you've cranked that adjustment screw down really hard, so it's real easy for the gun to go flying.

Since most people are talking about range holsters, where active retention is not necessary, there are plenty of holsters that do it better for roughly the same price. There is the Blade Tech Revolution series, for example. There are also a few options from Safariland for around the $30 price range. We can argue about the training issue all day long. At the end of the day, it's just generally a poor design getting the trigger finger involved in deactivating the retention mechanism. If you need retention, there are other better, safer, more robust designs. If you don't need retention, why waste time with a holster that really doesn't do anything particularly well? I do have one Serpa left, for a Sig P226R no less (hmm, an excuse to buy another gun at some point in the future I think!). I cut the Serpa button bump (that grabs the trigger guard) off and cranked that adjustment screw down. Problem solved.

 

[40Arpent]

I still don't see how it's more dangerous.

It forces you to put your index finger where it doesn't belong during the draw stroke. That, IMO, is how it is more dangerous.

 

[Texanjoker]

The Serpa is just a poor design in general. I mean, if you really need a retention holster, Safariland is pretty much the way to go (ALS or SLS or both). The serpa offers extremely poor retention in that a simple and light bump of the button will easily release the gun. Imagine getting body slammed to the ground and landing on your holster side. Usually with serpas, without the retention of the button, there is little to no other retention on the gun unless you've cranked that adjustment screw down really hard, so it's real easy for the gun to go flying.

Since most people are talking about range holsters, where active retention is not necessary, there are plenty of holsters that do it better for roughly the same price. There is the Blade Tech Revolution series, for example. There are also a few options from Safariland for around the $30 price range. We can argue about the training issue all day long. At the end of the day, it's just generally a poor design getting the trigger finger involved in deactivating the retention mechanism. If you need retention, there are other better, safer, more robust designs. If you don't need retention, why waste time with a holster that really doesn't do anything particularly well? I do have one Serpa left, for a Sig P226R no less (hmm, an excuse to buy another gun at some point in the future I think!). I cut the Serpa button bump (that grabs the trigger guard) off and cranked that adjustment screw down. Problem solved.

I am the opposite when at the range. I want to practice with what I carry. Regardless of the brand, that is how you keep your muscle memory. Perfect example is when people unsnap their holster to qualify and "speed" up their firing. What happens when it hits the fan? They will probably forget to unsnap the holster.

I also like how the gun comes out of the serpa. My finger is extended straight and never on the trigger. The gun comes out in that position. For those that don't train and put their finger on the trigger this could be an issue.

As far as retention I have had co-workers get their guns taken using level iii safari lands with the shroud attachment (mandatory where I used to work). If the crook is going for your gun, you best be able to count on more then just the holsters retention to keep your gun. The last incident I was at the suspect ended up with 2 in the back from another officer as he had the gun out of the holster during the fight.

 

[Combative W]

The design flaw is one of the biggest issues. For those that say they train with it all day long and never have a problem, I am always interested in exactly the type of training that is involved. Going to the range and plinking is not training. Training has to be conducive for the intended purpose or use. The body will go through a natural and uncontrollable series of automatic responses when true life or death stress is introduced. One of those uncontrollable responses will be the reflex/clinching of the hands. If your training does not include simulated adrenaline and automatic response actions into the ciricculum, then you are not getting the full potential and understanding of what goes on in a dynamic incident such as using a firearm when seconds matter. I have seen near accidents happen when students attend a class and true stress training is introduced. Everything they think they know goes out the window because they have not experienced those reactions in real time. This is where I have seen fingers go where they shouldn't. Add in the fact that the unlocking mechanism is in an unsafe place and you have the potential for a ND. This is just one issue that makes the holster in itself not acceptable. Just simply trying to pass on relevant info so people can be educated in where they spend their earned dollars. Lot's of myths and bad info out there.

 

[Jon Payne]

I have witnessed with my own two eyes a SERPA fail in a class. During a 0-5 feet Pistol Gunfighting course the student was working from a supine position. A small pebble became lodged in the paddle release and locked the handgun in the holster. It took a screw driver and hammer to free the pistol. The SERPA is a poor design. I've been forced to use one in the past while in a casual uniform and I'm very happy I no longer have to use one.

 

[Texanjoker]

The design flaw is one of the biggest issues. For those that say they train with it all day long and never have a problem, I am always interested in exactly the type of training that is involved. Going to the range and plinking is not training. Training has to be conducive for the intended purpose or use. The body will go through a natural and uncontrollable series of automatic responses when true life or death stress is introduced. One of those uncontrollable responses will be the reflex/clinching of the hands. If your training does not include simulated adrenaline and automatic response actions into the ciricculum, then you are not getting the full potential and understanding of what goes on in a dynamic incident such as using a firearm when seconds matter. I have seen near accidents happen when students attend a class and true stress training is introduced. Everything they think they know goes out the window because they have not experienced those reactions in real time. This is where I have seen fingers go where they shouldn't. Add in the fact that the unlocking mechanism is in an unsafe place and you have the potential for a ND. This is just one issue that makes the holster in itself not acceptable. Just simply trying to pass on relevant info so people can be educated in where they spend their earned dollars. Lot's of myths and bad info out there.

Just like every other topic, everybody has the right to their own opinion. Fortunately there are many brands so everybody can find what works for them. You did make the good point about when stress is introduced. People freak out at a range over a little stress but think they are ready for a real encounter?Personally I train as I work for real life scenarios in police work as I have done so for over 2 decades. Having worked high risk units, and been in real shootings, I take it very serious. What you do in real life is what you do in training. I always say "if you knew you were going to fight for your life tomorrow, would you change the way you trained today?"

 

[Combative W]

Texanjoker - That is what I constantly try and inform people about, true stress and how the body reacts to a real life SHTF moment. It sure as hell ain't like the movies. There are many that put on a uniform or carry a firearm on a daily basis and truly have no concept of what fighting for your life truly entails. I would say within the shooting community, there is probably only around 10% at most, that get or attend true reality based training. It is scary when you think about it. But then again, that is why we are here. To try and educate and pass knowledge onto others. If I am not sucking wind (breathing hard), sweating, a little beat up, and mentally and physically uncomfortable, then I am not pushing myself or my training to its fullest potential.

 

[Rangel]

 

[M. Sage]

It forces you to put your index finger where it doesn't belong during the draw stroke. That, IMO, is how it is more dangerous.

Your finger shouldn't be indexed on the side of the frame above the trigger??

Have you even looked closely at how these holsters work? Because when you take a grip on an unholstered handgun and index your finger along the frame, that is where the release is when you grip a pistol holstered in a SERPA.

The design flaw is one of the biggest issues. For those that say they train with it all day long and never have a problem, I am always interested in exactly the type of training that is involved. Going to the range and plinking is not training. Training has to be conducive for the intended purpose or use. The body will go through a natural and uncontrollable series of automatic responses when true life or death stress is introduced. One of those uncontrollable responses will be the reflex/clinching of the hands. If your training does not include simulated adrenaline and automatic response actions into the ciricculum, then you are not getting the full potential and understanding of what goes on in a dynamic incident such as using a firearm when seconds matter. I have seen near accidents happen when students attend a class and true stress training is introduced. Everything they think they know goes out the window because they have not experienced those reactions in real time. This is where I have seen fingers go where they shouldn't. Add in the fact that the unlocking mechanism is in an unsafe place and you have the potential for a ND. This is just one issue that makes the holster in itself not acceptable. Just simply trying to pass on relevant info so people can be educated in where they spend their earned dollars. Lot's of myths and bad info out there.

I shoot in competition with it. Yes, I roll some ghetto gear... I do get an adrenaline rush when I shoot 3 gun, and I'm usually so focused on following my strategy for the stage, I have to allow all the "little stuff" like reloads, draw stroke, etc. to go on auto.

Last time I shot, I was standing too close to a port, drew my pistol and pushed out... and punched the edge of the window, cut my hand open and didn't realize that I was dripping blood until I went to sit down and catch my breath.