Houston McDonald's Robbery

[txinvestigator]

And suddenly TI stops responding.

I was busy, sheesh.

 

[txinvestigator]

Since you've got all the damn answers, every time, what would you do?

I don't see how fighting my way out of a bad situation is so wrong.

It seems to me some seem to think shit in real life works like it does on TV.

I already gave you a huge indication of what I would do. Unassing from a vehicle that is blocked in is a better idea than trying to smash your car out of the block. You can move faster on foot than your car can move when blocked. Cars provide little cover at all, and practically zero from the driver's seat.

And the idea that the drive through is any safer than walking in is arguable. Crime happens to people in vehicles. We just had a thread about the dude shot in his car and killed while leaving a shopping mall with his wife.

Most of this is incident specific dynamic. Because of that, trying to decide what to do while sitting on our couches is often academic. I realize that most of us cannot afford the money or time to invest to properly train for these types of encounters. That is why talking about them is a good idea. Don't have ONE idea as to what to do. Have a plan A and plan B, and then an "aww hell plan". Remember the OODA loop, 3/4 second reaction time. Once a bad guy starts his act, by the time you recognize it, or observe it (the first "O" in the OODA loop) you are are behind the curve. Getting back inside his loop will be difficult.

I guess my issue is people who think they can take on 6 armed men, even if they come in one at a time through the door. I believe TV and movies have conditioned people to think they can do things that don't work in real life. Have you (you meant generically) tried to move another vehicle that is in park or with the drivers foot on the brake with your vehicle from a standstill? Have you shot into or out of a vehicle? Do you KNOW how bullets really act through vehicles?

Did you know that it takes several seconds to work through the OODA loop when caught by surprise? Even from condition yellow getting to "Act" can take several seconds. Not fractions of a second. If you are standing in line ordering your Big Mac and these armed men come rushing in, you will not have the presence of mind to immediately conduct a Hondo roll, draw mid roll and begin firing, hitting each with one stopping shot before the others can react. You will, more likely, turn in shock while your mind tries to sort out what is happening. (orient) Then once your brain realizes "holy crap this is really a robbery" then you have to decide on a course of action. All of that takes time.

That said, if forced to then fight. If shooting starts in such a situation I am prepared to defend myself. What is the saying, "you might find me dead in a ditch but it will be in a pile of brass" ? I think that is close.........

I know a SWAT cop who has been trained by the best national trainers in the states. He was part of the Department of State Anti Terrorism Assistance program, being assigned to numerous countries training their people in Anti terrorism. Hell hole countries. D has been under fire. I have seen this guy shoot, seen him move. He is good.

One night after work he ventured into his local Waffle House for breakfast. He was alone and armed, in plain clothes. 3 armed guys came in and robbed the place. This well trained, seasoned professional knew his odds were poor inside the store. He began to make strong mental notes of the incident. He observed the demeanor of the suspects. He decided to wait. Had they started shooting he was 100% prepared to engage. But these guys seemed scared and nervous to him. He was worried if he engaged first they would panic fire, possibly shooting others in the place. D waiting until they left and gave pursuit. He apprehended one, responding units caught one and number three got away that night.

His reactions to that are a strong indicator for ME. How about y'all?

I don't mean to belittle anyone. I just think many of us have a glamorous idea of what these incidents are like. Sorry if I offended.

 

[txinvestigator]

Thanks but I'd rather stub a toe than give YOU any of my personal information.

So the romance is over?

 

[scap99]

Txi, thanks for the detailed response.

Much appreciated. Short responses sometimes come across as being sarcastic...

 

[Sapper740]

It was bad already Katrina refugees had a devastating effect.

The only solution I can see would be for the state to declare them an invasive species and authorize any and all removal methods.

Just a brief glimpse into the life and minds of the thugs:

west | damilare sonoiki films

Well, that was painful to watch....and listen to. Did they say "f" or "n" more, it was hard to tell? Time to send S.W.A.T. down to "da Swat".

 

[Sapper740]

Well, that was painful to watch....and listen to. Did they say "$#@!" or "$#@!" more, it was hard to tell? Time to send S.W.A.T. down to "da Swat".

That would be the "F" bomb and the "N" word.

 

[HillRider]

I'm sorry to break it to txinvestigator, but cops do not always know the best way to handle these types of situations. When was the last time you heard of a store clerk or chl holder getting killed in a shootout with multiple armed assailants? Not too often. It certainly could happen, and we all must follow our own judgments, but to go on like this and criticize people who are sick of this shit is just low. I'm sure LE would rather there not be CHL holders or armed store clerks. They should all just get on their knees and do what the thugs say. Movies? I call bullshit on that one too. These thugs are not looking to get in a close quarters shootout and they are not brave. They have drawn on me before. They are not fast, nor accurate. Enough of the self-righteous bs.

 

[jordanmills]

Since we are "postulating"; unless you get blocked in by other cars and are blocked in. In LE we call a vehicle a kill zone. If you cannot drive away in a vehicle being attacked, unassing is wise.

I was almost in that spot on a backed up freeway overpass with someone road raging behind me. The only viable plan of action that came to mind should they get out and want to come make it personal was to get on my feet and head on down the road.

 

[Sapper740]

And suddenly TI stops responding.

Can't a man take a dump?

 

[TXARGUY]

Let's see here; shitty food that their own employee website admits will kill you, dirty surfaces everywhere, rude customers with dirty little snotty nosed kids running around screaming and touching everything, rude untrained and uncaring employees, and now armed thugs running amok shoving sideways held guns in everyone's faces...

I can see no reason not to avoid the place completely.

I can get my artery clogging burger fix elsewhere.

 

[txinvestigator]

I'm sorry to break it to txinvestigator, but cops do not always know the best way to handle these types of situations. When was the last time you heard of a store clerk or chl holder getting killed in a shootout with multiple armed assailants? Not too often. It certainly could happen, and we all must follow our own judgments, but to go on like this and criticize people who are sick of this shit is just low. I'm sure LE would rather there not be CHL holders or armed store clerks. They should all just get on their knees and do what the thugs say. Movies? I call bullshit on that one too. These thugs are not looking to get in a close quarters shootout and they are not brave. They have drawn on me before. They are not fast, nor accurate. Enough of the self-righteous bs.

I write from experience. If you think taking on 6 armed robbers is wise, then your thought process is too out of whack for me to help. Do what you gotta do. And your comments about cops....who said anything about COPS. I made a specific story about ONE cop. One I suspect has more experience in the battles than you can fathom. I'll take his guidance over yours any day, every time.

Sorry if I damaged your Rambo vision.
And about self-righteous.....do you know the story about the pot and kettle?

 

[txinvestigator]

Can't a man take a dump?

shhhhh!

 

[txinvestigator]

Let's see here; shitty food that their own employee website admits will kill you, dirty surfaces everywhere, rude customers with dirty little snotty nosed kids running around screaming and touching everything, rude untrained and uncaring employees, and now armed thugs running amok shoving sideways held guns in everyone's faces...

I can see no reason not to avoid the place completely.

I can get my artery clogging burger fix elsewhere.

That sounds like a terrific plan A. Funny you mention it, but I have not been in a fast food place for over a year.

 

[txinvestigator]

Txi, thanks for the detailed response.

Much appreciated. Short responses sometimes come across as being sarcastic...

 

[Younggun]

That sounds like a terrific plan A. Funny you mention it, but I have not been in a fast food place for over a year.

I have to go to Wendy's for my baconators

 

[Skip]

I have to go to Wendy's for my baconators

Great, now I want a Double Baconator...

"Character is doing the right thing even when no one is watching"

 

[Vaquero]

TXI makes valid points. (dammit! )
However, just laying back and taking what they give just don't set well with me.

I really don't know how I would react because, thankfully, I haven't been put in that situation.
Damn the torpedoes! Full speed ahead!

 

[txinvestigator]

However, just laying back and taking what they give just don't set well with me.

Me either.

 

[matefrio]

I was a cashier and 16 years old when I got robbed by a guy with a 380 pistol. While he got my manager to open the drawer I had a window and went for my buck knife. Luckily I'd left the knife at home in what I assure you was a very rare occurrence.

After not finding the knife I decided to take mental notes on him head to toe.

The second window was when he turned and ran through the doors. I went after him thinking that I could take him physically.
Again some sense came to me and I never made it passed the second set of doors.

He was caught and charged with 15 robberies. I was one of two to ID him and not only him but every piece of clothing he had on and the gun.

The customer standing in line behind him had no idea what had happened.

Forgetting that knife and not following him to the parking lot most likely saved my young life.

 

[HillRider]

I write from experience. If you think taking on 6 armed robbers is wise, then your thought process is too out of whack for me to help. Do what you gotta do. And your comments about cops....who said anything about COPS. I made a specific story about ONE cop. One I suspect has more experience in the battles than you can fathom. I'll take his guidance over yours any day, every time.

Sorry if I damaged your Rambo vision.
And about self-righteous.....do you know the story about the pot and kettle?

One thing you forgot. I never gave any advice nor said what I would do. Unless you are there in that moment, you don't know what you would do. I can tell you have a lot of contempt for regular folks. That's okay, it's expected.