Pistol taken at gun point on minor traffic stop

[breakingcontact]

The prevailing attitude in LE these days is more "as long as the officer goes home safe" than protect and serve.

That is well said and more than I usually say with 100 words. Well done.

I think that is why people get shot who don't need shot. The officers aren't going to take the chance. They ARE going to go home. It's a battlefield mentality imported to our streets.

 

[breakingcontact]

No, its not.

If i'm an officer, I have CHL in my hand and I have no reason to believe the individual I just stopped is about to get violent, I can draw my gun and aim it at him?

So eventually that can just be the standard procedure. Drawn down on all CHL holders who identify as armed. Then next will be to handcuff them. Then take them to jail, they can prove their innocence in court.

 

[FlashBang]

Back in the day, if I was concerned about it my response would have been to thank him for informing me that he had a firearm and then to ask him to please allow me to take possession of it until the stop was over; for his safety and mine. I then would have moved to a position slightly behind the drivers door pillar and nonchalantly rested my hand on my own weapon. Puts me in position to draw and fire before he could even get the weapon in my direction. I only ever took possession of a CHL holders firearm one time... and that was because the idiot didn't inform me about it being in his glove box and he popped the glove box open for his insurance card and started reaching in. I guess some of us old guys were just more confident then they are now.

 

[Renegade]

No, its not.

Hilarious if it was not so serious. I would love to know what Agency/Dept has a policy of telling officers who feel their life is in such imminent danger they have a gun pointed at the perp that they should then increase their risk by having the perp pull gun from holster and hand it to them.

This is not TV. No real cop tells a perp to pull a gun on them. Imagine the outcry of how stupid the cop was if a cop did this and the perp shot him instead of handing gun over.

 

[majormadmax]

My contrarian view is the cop made a stop, and before he even said anything to the driver, the drivers first words are "I have a gun".

As you often point out, do you know what the cop knows? Did you see all the BOLOs and Amber alerts that cop was given just prior to the stop? Perhaps there were other indicators that alerted the cop something was wrong.

I doubt you or any other instructor recommends this route of dialogue with a cop on a stop.

Could be, it's hard to diagnose what happened with only some of the information. I'm not questioning AKMike's side of the story, but as you said, we are only getting one side (his) and there could be other factors involved.

Still, I would think some kind of explanation is owed to AKMike. That is not a typical reaction by a police officer if there was no threat present, and it doesn't seem like a felony traffic stop as they are a lot more hyper than what AKMike described as the officer's demeanor. If there were mitigating factors, once the situation is under control and the officer should have explained why he reacted the way he did, even if it's just a few basic facts (e.g. "we have a BOLO out that matches your vehicle or description," etc.).

I am interested in hearing the department's response, and, as others have said, that it ended without further drama!

Cheers! M2

 

[txinvestigator]

I am thoroughly convinced you are/were the same kind of LEO my dad was. Honest, hard working, and have a healthy level of common sense.
What you do not seem to get( or maybe you are in denial over) is that things like the OP describe are very much common place these days and no amount of reporting it to their superiors is going to change the behavior ( unless it is caught on camera and can embarrass the department)

The prevailing attitude in LE these days is more "as long as the officer goes home safe" than protect and serve.

I don't know what you want from me. I wrote that the behavior was unreasonable. Are you wanting me to say the OP should have shot the fucker? And I don't believe for ONE TINY SECOND, that drawing down on license holders is "common place" I have seen hundreds of renewal students over the last decade. Not one has ever described anything like the OP described. I also know many, many cops, and they just don't care about your gun.

The OP experienced atypical behavior.

 

[txinvestigator]

Hilarious if it was not so serious. I would love to know what Agency/Dept has a policy of telling officers who feel their life is in such imminent danger they have a gun pointed at the perp that they should then increase their risk by having the perp pull gun from holster and hand it to them.

This is not TV. No real cop tells a perp to pull a gun on them. Imagine the outcry of how stupid the cop was if a cop did this and the perp shot him instead of handing gun over.

Your statement shows that the officer did not react in a rational manner. The cop did not feel he was in imminent danger. He was filling his ego and putting on a show.

And please, this is not TV, we don't use the word "perp" in Texas.

 

[txinvestigator]

If i'm an officer, I have CHL in my hand and I have no reason to believe the individual I just stopped is about to get violent, I can draw my gun and aim it at him?

Is THAT what you asked? Because the answer to that question is no. I am positive I already wrote, before you were even in this thread, that the officers actions were unreasonable.

So eventually that can just be the standard procedure. Drawn down on all CHL holders who identify as armed. Then next will be to handcuff them. Then take them to jail, they can prove their innocence in court.

Your blind dislike of the police is affecting your comprehension, again. No one here wrote anything remotely suggesting anything like that.

 

[Renegade]

The cop did not feel he was in imminent danger.

You know that how? You talk to him recently?

Seriously if anyone else was making the statements you are making , you would all over them for jumping to conclusions not in evidence.

It is like someone else is typing on your keyboard. Do we need to send an officer to your house to make sure you are safe?

This thread is epic.

 

[AKM]

Some of the stuff other guys are saying is what I kind of thought with the BOLO or something, but he walked up normal and as soon as I said "I have a CHL, My pistols in a holster by my wallet" he stepped back and drew. then he asked for me to give it to him and I made it a point to hand it to him in a safe/no way in hell to think its threatening manner. Also I can understand the one side of the story part mentioned above, but thats what happened word for word.

Younggun

I would have gave it to him had he asked either way if I wanted to or not, Im not one of these youtube guys that argue with the Police for the sake of arguing, but it was odd. I comply these guys for the most part are out doing a job, and arent looking for a hassle. Infact I think thats why Ive never gotten a ticket when Ive been pulled over because Im honest, its Yes Sir No sir, and I dont hassle them....Thi8s was just a weird deal all in all lol.

 

[AKM]

You know that how? You talk to him recently?

Seriously if anyone else was making the statements you are making , you would all over them for jumping to conclusions not in evidence.

It is like someone else is typing on your keyboard. Do we need to send an officer to your house to make sure you are safe?

This thread is epic.

I think he may be saying that because the guy was calm and being pretty friendly for the most part.

 

[breakingcontact]

Your blind dislike of the police is affecting your comprehension, again.

I wouldn't strongly dislike an individual officer who pointed a weapon at me for no reason, yes. The ones that didn't I'd be just fine with. 2 cops live in my neighborhood. Tell you what TXI, I'll try and make friends with them. If they don't shoot me or run me over with an MRAP I'll let you know how it goes.

What academy do local cops go to? Same one for DPS or?

Seems to be a lack of discipline out there (cop bashing cop bashing cop bashing).

 

[F350-6]

I'm far from being an expert on this (last speeding ticket was 91), but I've got a few questions. What kind of vehicle do you drive? Any stickers or markings that would draw attention? Weaving around in your lane? Do you look like Bin Laden or something?

At 3-5 mph over, I don't even tap my brakes and leave the cruise control on as I drive past a cop shooting radar at me. It seems to me that there was some reason other than 3 - 5 over that might have instigated the stop. Or maybe the guy was just a polite idiot and there isn't another side to the story.

After it was almost over and he had returned your weapon to you, did you ask him why he felt it necessary to draw his weapon on you?

It is MORE than not normal. It is perfectly legal for law abiding citizens to carry handguns in their motor vehicles. You seem to be a lot calmer than would be. You have several options. Contact the department and file a complaint. You might contact the DA in the county, as well.

It might not hurt to contact a civil lawyer.

..... Based on the POV presented here, the officer over-reacted.

Cop basher. Remember, there are always two sides to the story.

Sorry. Couldn't resist, but it's not often that we see you taking the side opposing the LEO so quickly. Not saying you're ready to hang him, but you don't seem to give this LEO the benefit of the doubt.

 

[breakingcontact]

After it was almost over and he had returned your weapon to you, did you ask him why he felt it necessary to draw his weapon on you?

I don't think most people would be in the frame of mind or willing to ask, lest you have the gun pointed at you again. If you did, a big +1 but I don't blame you if you didn't.

 

[AKM]

I'm far from being an expert on this (last speeding ticket was 91), but I've got a few questions. What kind of vehicle do you drive? Any stickers or markings that would draw attention? Weaving around in your lane? Do you look like Bin Laden or something?

At 3-5 mph over, I don't even tap my brakes and leave the cruise control on as I drive past a cop shooting radar at me. It seems to me that there was some reason other than 3 - 5 over that might have instigated the stop. Or maybe the guy was just a polite idiot and there isn't another side to the story.

After it was almost over and he had returned your weapon to you, did you ask him why he felt it necessary to draw his weapon on you?







Cop basher. Remember, there are always two sides to the story.

Sorry. Couldn't resist, but it's not often that we see you taking the side opposing the LEO so quickly. Not saying you're ready to hang him, but you don't seem to give this LEO the benefit of the doubt.

I drive a single cab truck with no stickers of any kind. All my lights/signals work, have front/rear matching plates, and I was on a two lane Farm to market road driving straight, The only thing that would stick out is the fact Im tall enough I look through the top 3'' of the windshield where its blue. I have a clean driving record, and have never been in trouble for anything.

oh he did specifically ask if I had warrants never been asked that before. I forgot about that part I kind of think he was just bored....

 

[AKM]

I don't think most people would be in the frame of mind or willing to ask, lest you have the gun pointed at you again. If you did, a big +1 but I don't blame you if you didn't.

I didn't ask he didn't have a ticket for me so I wasn't going to push the issue.

 

[Hoji]

I don't know what you want from me. I wrote that the behavior was unreasonable. Are you wanting me to say the OP should have shot the fucker? And I don't believe for ONE TINY SECOND, that drawing down on license holders is "common place" I have seen hundreds of renewal students over the last decade. Not one has ever described anything like the OP described. I also know many, many cops, and they just don't care about your gun.

The OP experienced atypical behavior.

There are over half a million CHL holders in Texas. The less than one percent you have in your class is hardly representative of all CHL/ LEO encounters.
I have handcuffed on the side of the road and told that the fact that I have a handgun(and a CHL) was all the PC needed to conduct a non consensual search of my vehicle.

You are usually very quick to discount anyone not in blue, and just as quick to defend any abhorrent behavior committed by LE.

Based on my experiences, this seems to be getting more typical all the time.

 

[F350-6]

I drive a single cab truck with no stickers of any kind. All my lights/signals work, have front/rear matching plates, and I was on a two lane Farm to market road driving straight, The only thing that would stick out is the fact Im tall enough I look through the top 3'' of the windshield where its blue. I have a clean driving record, and have never been in trouble for anything.

oh he did specifically ask if I had warrants never been asked that before. I forgot about that part I kind of think he was just bored....

Single cab truck on a FM road doing 3 mph over sounds more like you matched a very general description of someone that is being looked for. That could explain a cop sitting on a two lane road on a fishing expedition and getting antsy when you said you had a gun but didn't hand him a permit first.

A long time ago I was pulled over because I was a young male driving a blue chevy pickup truck in a certain area. (let's change that to a few months ago so the young part doesn't seem so distant ) The deputy acted pretty funny and gave me a weird feeling. He was just checking me out and let me go pretty quick. I asked a cop buddy that night about it and he told me about how everyone was looking for some guy who was reportedly driving around in a 60's model blue chevy truck.

 

[AKM]

Single cab truck on a FM road doing 3 mph over sounds more like you matched a very general description of someone that is being looked for. That could explain a cop sitting on a two lane road on a fishing expedition and getting antsy when you said you had a gun but didn't hand him a permit first.

A long time ago I was pulled over because I was a young male driving a blue chevy pickup truck in a certain area. (let's change that to a few months ago so the young part doesn't seem so distant ) The deputy acted pretty funny and gave me a weird feeling. He was just checking me out and let me go pretty quick. I asked a cop buddy that night about it and he told me about how everyone was looking for some guy who was reportedly driving around in a 60's model blue chevy truck.

He sits there most everyday looking for speeders, there's several neighborhoods/businesses and schools on the road its not deserted or anything. I was just thinking about things other than my speed, but Im pretty good at guessing my speed without looking usually.


And like I said I couldn't get my wallet out, and me moving around digging wasn't going to help things any that would have looked suspicious as hell more so when he would have saw my CHL and he would have asked where it was..."oh right where I was digging around". I think hands on the wheel asking to grab my card was my better option at the time honestly, but I get what you're saying.

 

[breakingcontact]

I drive a single cab truck with no stickers of any kind. All my lights/signals work, have front/rear matching plates, and I was on a two lane Farm to market road driving straight, The only thing that would stick out is the fact Im tall enough I look through the top 3'' of the windshield where its blue. I have a clean driving record, and have never been in trouble for anything.

oh he did specifically ask if I had warrants never been asked that before. I forgot about that part I kind of think he was just bored....

Front and rear plates have to match? Oh!