Don't Feed the Ammo Flippers

[recoveringyankee]

Actually, I'm talking about from the time it leaves the manufacturer to the time it hits a retailer.......at the distributor level.....one step up from retail.....and very few are positioned in that spot.

It's a good spot to be in when market conditions like this exist.

 

[1slow01Z71]

arji, did you sign in just to bitch about this or what?

No doubt IF there are people at the distribution centers doing what you say its BS, but I seriously doubt it. Ive built a walmart distribution center and an HEB distribution center. EVERYTHING, and I mean EVERYTHING has a barcode tagged on its ass even the workers. Stuff like ammo comes in on pallets that are wrapped and never get unwrapped before they go into a truck. The much more likely scenario is that workers at the actual stores are tossing ammo under the counter or hiding it in the back for buddys.

Regardless, the market has created this need. Once the idiots stop paying the idiotic prices the market will correct itself. Eventually the morons will run out of money and then all the hoarders who dont even shoot or need the ammo they have stockpiled will release it back onto the market. I doubt we will be buying ammo at below cost but it will be plentiful and easily obtainable.

Apparently some of you missed your economics classes in high school and/or college. Capitalism is a beautiful thing, it corrects prices on its own. Now if only we could get the .gov to quit screwing with it we might be alright.

 

[Shorts]

No one missed ECO 101.

 

[kabob]

I agree with a lot of the sentiments expressed in this thread in response to the OP. I let my ammo stocks get ridiculously low as I'd stopped shooting for a bit in the winter due to the cold and just plain being busy. But it's only been 4 months since the panic buying started and I've been able to replenish and then some. Granted, I haven't always paid pre-panic prices (especially on 5.56/.223 and .308/7.62NATO) but for the most part, I have. Just a matter of keeping an eye out whenever someone posts a heads-up or physically visiting Walmart and Cabela's (though their prices have gone up at the retail level, unfortunately) or ordering online as soon as a deal pops up in the wee hours of the morning.

 

[lalonguecarabine]

...EVERYTHING, and I mean EVERYTHING has a barcode tagged on its ass even the workers. Stuff like ammo comes in on pallets that are wrapped and never get unwrapped before they go into a truck...

This man speaks the truth.
It's the same for Cabela's. If anyone decides to "divert" some product to their personal stash, they will shortly find themselves no longer in that position (or any other position in that company, for that matter).

arji, ammo flippers suck, but they're simply a fact of life in our lifestyle. We all feel your pain. Even the people who are adequately stocked aren't happy with the current prices, and are glad they have large amounts at home from which to draw from.

 

[TXARGUY]

or ordering online as soon as a deal pops up in the wee hours of the morning.

I can't tell you how many times I've popped out of bed in the middle of the night because I got an in stock email or text on my phone. Ran to the office and got that shit ordered. Sometimes I've been on my computer hitting submit on my order within a minute of receiving the email or text and still got beat by faster people. Did I want to hunt down the faster ones and give them a good piece of my mind? No. I just went back to bed determined to be faster the next time.

I can hear those emails and texts come in even through the deepest sleep. Much like the slightest cough from my daughter down the hall would have me out of bed in seconds when she was younger.

 

[1slow01Z71]

No one missed ECO 101.

So maybe it didnt sink in? One of those mind out of body experiences perhaps. I had a lot of those during college, especially in english literature.

Its been the better part of a decade and a lot of alcohol ago but its called opportunity cost. Some peoples time is worth more than others, to some its more cost effective to pay more for the things they want rather than waste time bouncing from store to store and scouring the ends of the internet for in stock ammo. While others who apparently didnt pay attention to the ammo shortage in 08 are set to learn the same lesson over again. During a time when they couldve been stocking up they chose to spend their money on other things. Few goods have appreciated as much as ammo in the last few months so those other "investments" were poor choices. Obviously there are exceptions to the rule, such as yourself since you were going to serve our country but the vast majority of people have no excuse other than ignorance. I feel no pitty for people who were caught with their pants down. So again its simple economics and apparently many either didnt pay attention in class or are just choosing to bitch because they werent prepared.

 

[Shorts]

1slow01Z71, you act as if I should like the situation. I don't have to like it. I don't like it. Has nothing to do with my education, everything to do with not being able to buy ammo on my local shelves. Cut the crap.



As for pallets being raided at a distributor, doubt it. Ammo is being picked up right at the retail level. There's a 'how to' circulating around on how to check your local walmarts so you can check the stock and get it late night (at 24hr stores), as it goes from the stock room to the shelf. The other way is people line up right at 7am (or whatever opening time) at other retailers that sell ammo and grab it all up.

Supply is flowing from the manf. to retails. But it contracts into a narrow vein when resellers grab it off the shelves and funnel it to forums or online auctions. I see a lot of this on ar15.com exchange. Tons of resellers there in all calibers.

 

[Hoji]

You're right, ramping up for a year long deployment and getting our shit straight for that should have taken a back seat. What were we thinking
.

I work overseas as well. Takes no time out of your ramping up to check websites and order ammo. What were you doing between 2009 and 2012 that prevented you from ordering ammo? My last hitch in Saudi I ordered ammo and it was delivered and waiting on me when I got home. This was last week.

 

[1slow01Z71]

1slow01Z71, you act as if I should like the situation. I don't have to like it. I don't like it. Has nothing to do with my education, everything to do with not being able to buy ammo on my local shelves. Cut the crap.

Never said I like it either. I enjoy shooting just like the rest of you, thats why Im on the forum but you seem to be hell bent on just bitching about something you had control over. You couldve been stocking up for the last 4 years to feed your ammo need. Instead you want to blame the market like liberals blame the gun for crimes. Your arguments all glaze over the fact that YOU didnt prepare and now think things should be handed to you. Thats not the way the world works, if a consumable is very important for you to have then it would stand to reason you might want to have enough in stock to forgo any shortage that might occur. You saw it in 08 and Im pretty sure for the last 4 years you knew another election was coming up with a candidate that could cause another ammo shortage. You didnt need a crystal ball to see this coming.

Primers, powder and bulk 22 were hard to get all through 2012.

 

[Shorts]

I have ammo.

If yall don't want to read ammo griping quit clicking on ammo griping threads.

 

[GlockontheRocks]

I had several bricks of .22. They had been on the back shelf of my closet for a few years. I probably paid $ 12 a brick. They were probably 6 to 7 years old. I sold them to a guy for $70 per brick. 10 bricks and $100 for 4 stripped lowers. Did I gouge him or did he gouge me? Let's see, I got 4 lowers for $220 dollars. I know he sold the bricks of 22 for $ 80 each. = $800 + $ 100 cash, why that SOB got $ 900 for 4 lowers he probably had $ 280 dollars in. Do I care no. He had what I needed, I supplied what he needed. Was I wrong to sell at $70? No, I won't be "ethical" and sell for take-out prices and buy for caviar prices for the same take-out. Still not sure who made out better. Either way we are both happy.

 

[Greg_TX]

To those of you chastising people for "not stocking up", why do I see so many posts from the same people saying they've cut back on range trips or have even stopping shooting for the time being? What's your problem - you have plenty of ammo, right?

 

[Shuutr]

I had several bricks of .22. They had been on the back shelf of my closet for a few years. I probably paid $ 12 a brick. They were probably 6 to 7 years old. I sold them to a guy for $70 per brick. 10 bricks and $100 for 4 stripped lowers. Did I gouge him or did he gouge me? Let's see, I got 4 lowers for $220 dollars. I know he sold the bricks of 22 for $ 80 each. = $800 + $ 100 cash, why that SOB got $ 900 for 4 lowers he probably had $ 280 dollars in. Do I care no. He had what I needed, I supplied what he needed. Was I wrong to sell at $70? No, I won't be "ethical" and sell for take-out prices and buy for caviar prices for the same take-out. Still not sure who made out better. Either way we are both happy.

There is a difference between selling stuff you had prior to the crunch than buying during the shortage at retail with the intent selling for an unreasonable profit.

 

[recoveringyankee]

There is a difference between selling stuff you had prior to the crunch than buying during the shortage at retail with the intent selling for an unreasonable profit.

What is "unreasonable profit"?? Should the buyers be prevented from spending the ammount of money they want? Should the sellers be prevented from selling at a price the buyers accept? Should you be able to define what reasonable profit is, should I, should some guy in Washington DC? Who should have that power?

I'll give you a hint, that power rests in the hands of the buyer and nobody should be allowed to take it from them. You don't like the price, you don't buy, it's that simple. Enough buyers stop buying, that's called drop in demand, the sellers have to lower the asking price to stimulate buyer interest.

 

[GlockontheRocks]

There is a difference between selling stuff you had prior to the crunch than buying during the shortage at retail with the intent selling for an unreasonable profit.

But is it really unreasonable if you are taking your time and resources to find it? I believe it works both ways. We / most of us have friends that are involved in the shooting sports. They are your best resources for finding guns, ammo, and mags. This past weekend, I helped a friend buy a Sig AR at pre panic price at a local FFL. FFL called me to let me know one was coming. No gouge, just a good deal. Ammo is another issue. They buy at the local retailers too. Their shipments are coming in sparsly.


They mark up the boxes. They have added expense in each box. They too get up early and stand in line.
For that they bump it up. Not much but at least you'll find some ammo.

Bottom line, we are living in a double edged sword world right now.

 

[Shuutr]

I hear you. I do. And yes, market forces are market forces. Supply, demand, yeah yeah. I get it.

But since you focused on the term unreasonable profit, I'll try to explain what I mean. I'm not talking about establishing a rule about reasonable profit. But if I think it costs $15 for 50 round coins of cheap range ammo (when available). Some of that is materials. Some is equipment. Some is manpower. Delivery. Distribution. I imagine the manufacturer makes $2 profit a box (could be way off) and the retail store makes another buck, maybe two. I would expect a reasonable profit to be anywhere in the neighborhood of 25-50% markup for being the guy who knows how to get things. Hell, Otis Redding (Morgan Freeman) only marked up things in prison 20%. I would consider someone buying and selling a box for $60 ($45 profit) at a 300% markup on the next guy to be a tad unreasonable.

But hey, that's the going rate, so be it. I ain't buyin. I'm just observing and roll my eyes.

I consider it to be unreasonable to profit off someone like that, but I'm not a businessman.

 

[Shuutr]

They mark up the boxes. They have added expense in each box. They too get up early and stand in line.
For that they bump it up. Not much but at least you'll find some ammo.

I understand the modest bump to cover your costs. I don't think that is who we are complaining about. It's the bigger bumps that are hard to witness.

 

[navyguy]

There is no way in hell I'm getting up at 5 am to stand in line for two hours to buy a brick of .22. Any of you that think that's the way to go, great.. go for it. Then put it up on GunBroker for 3x the price and then laugh your way to the bank when suckers buy it for those inflated prices. But for anyone to suggest that not doing the aforementioned somehow diminishes their manly-hood, is well, let me say in a nice way, is informed.

 

[Shotgun Jeremy]

Hey-you wanna stand in line for some ammo? Be my guest. You wanna re-sell a $13 box of ammo for $25 to recoup your time-sorry bout your luck, jack! I'd rather throw rocks than let you try to rip me off.

Sent from Hicksville.....or while dreaming of Hicksville