What is Bill McCraven's problem with campus carry?

[skinman]

Yes, that is a typical victim profile. Blissful ignorance of the criminal risk. Glad you were not victimized.

I did not say that I was not keenly aware of my situation and surroundings, just that I never felt the need to be armed going to and from campus. The area around UH is a scary place to be late at night and there are bad people everywhere, but I felt safe on campus.

If a student does not feel safe on the campus he or she is attending, then maybe they need to find another campus...packing a handgun or toting an AR is not going to make it any safer for anybody, and indeed may make it less safe for everybody...

 

[Renegade]

So, skinflute, do you believe a 21 year old female student should be forced to fight a rapist on the same campus with her bare hands?

By his logic, Jessica Lynch can carry, but Kay Miculek cannot.

 

[Davetex]

Troll

 

[skinman]

It drives me nuts, when guy's are saying that unless you have served in combat, your opinion is invalid. It takes everyone with different backgrounds to make America great. Get over yourself and try appreciating everyone.

"Character is doing the right thing even when no one is watching"

I am not saying that not having served in combat makes your opinions less valid, they are, after all, your own opinions. I am saying that I would value the opinion of someone who has BTDT over someone who has not.

And, you really need to learn how to accept that not everyone shares your opinion on everything and learn how to present and argue your points with respect and not stoop to personal attacks...it weakens your argument.

 

[Shotgun Jeremy]

Hey skinman, so is college the only place you attend that you feel comfortable at? I mean, you have a CHL and you're ok putting it aside on campus because of the normal threat factor, so where else has a low enough threat factor to leave your sidearm at home? While we're at it, what are the winning lotto numbers? I think I finally found someone who can help me hit it big.

 

[Younggun]

University of Houston crime statistics for 2013.

10 forcible sex offenses

14 Robberies

6 aggravated assaults

39 burglaries

23 motor vehicle thefts

2 arson

38 drug violations.


Source: http://www.uh.edu/police/2013-University-of-Houston-Annual-Security-and-Fire-Report.pdf

 

[RACER X]

So skinman, how do you feel about the avg citizen having a chl?

 

[Younggun]

I also took the oath and served two tours...and I carry legally...and I have a few weapons that I am very proficient with...and I also happen to vote Democrat which makes me a minority here so I guess that makes me a troll...

Or are the real trolls the ones who would rather call others trolls instead of arguing their points?

What I am reading here are a few folks who may have never served a day or may have never seen combat and who don't agree with a Navy SEAL on a hot button political issue so they disrespect him by marginalizing his service. That is not acceptable anytime, anyplace, or in any way and I take strong exception to anyone disrespecting a combat veteran's service for any reason. That, my fellow gun aficionados, is a very good way to start a flaming war...

There is absolutely no need for a college student to be sitting in class armed. No good can come of it. There is a time and place and that is not the time nor place.

Now, disagree and argue your points with respect and intelligence or KMA.

Do you believe a college is an inherently safe place to be as apposed to other locations?

Do you believe that someone who intends to do harm will not do so on a college campus because guns aren't allowed in the buildings?

Do you believe the presence of a firearm makes a place more dangerous?

Do you believe the current requirements for a CHL are not strict enough or that the classroom or range portion is inadequate?



I disagree on your point about marginalizing his service. It simply does not equate to the civilian world. There are plenty here with experience in the military, and in combat that disagree with him. Rank must be respected in the military, most who served deserve respect, but serving does not give one any special abilities in applying rights or knowing what is best for a college. In that situation, he's just a man with an opinion.

How can we have a discussion if you aren't willing to answer a few basic questions?

 

[Renegade]

Someone explain to me why campus guns (and OC) are going to be problems in Texas even though they are not problems in other states. Are Texans just stupid? Is it the shoes? What facts does anyone have to suggest campus guns (and OC) will not be just as safe as other states? Yeah ,there is none.

 

[vmax]

Sad when someone loses on all points and still dont know when to quit

He needs a new screen name

Black Knight

 

[Skip]

Man, you marginalized others opinions based on your own views of non-military folks. You don't think that is personal? I have always thanked and valued the military. And if we met, I would shake your hand and say thank you for your service. But, don't thank for a second, that my background and experience doesn't give me a reason for believing what I believe. I may not have experienced combat, but my opinion is just as reasonable to me, as yours is to you. I couldn't even imagine having to be in the same room while some nut job is killing people around me, knowing my gun is at the house, and look up and the barrel is pointed at me.
Just sayin'.....

"Character is doing the right thing even when no one is watching"

 

[Shotgun Jeremy]

I accidentally carried into my college class once. Good thing I didn't go into a fit of rage and start shooting everybody. You know how it goes. I carry into Walmart around everybody with no problem, but once I go to college that anger kicks in and I start chugging 40's in class. Last thing we need is a gun on me during all that.

 

[Acera]

I accidentally carried into my college class once. Good thing I didn't go into a fit of rage and start shooting everybody. You know how it goes. I carry into Walmart around everybody with no problem, but once I go to college that anger kicks in and I start chugging 40's in class. Last thing we need is a gun on me during all that.

I have done risky behavior also, carried into a bank once. Vault open and everything. Don't know why that evil gun I had did not make me rob it.......................

 

[peeps]

I did not say that I was not keenly aware of my situation and surroundings, just that I never felt the need to be armed going to and from campus. The area around UH is a scary place to be late at night and there are bad people everywhere, but I felt safe on campus.

If a student does not feel safe on the campus he or she is attending, then maybe they need to find another campus...packing a handgun or toting an AR is not going to make it any safer for anybody, and indeed may make it less safe for everybody...

Yea, I don't get your argument about campus carry being less safe than anywhere else. By getting a CHL, the citizen has already demonstrated they are responsible. Like others have said here, why would they change suddenly when they carry on campus? Stop creating an environment of dependency and, let's bolster the public's deterrence to crime.

Further, I don't think many here were marginalizing his military service. They were just wondering why, as a veteran of such stature, why would he choose Austin and pander to the liberal base? I guess he just doesn't share the same views as most of the rest of the SOF community (if you subscribe thinking of the other thread on invading Texas....). Oh well! I don't care how big-a hero you are, if you project something I don't agree with, I'm not going to just "trust your judgement" and follow along....

 

[RCK1999]

Man, you marginalized others opinions based on your own views of non-military folks. You don't think that is personal? I have always thanked and valued the military. And if we met, I would shake your hand and say thank you for your service. But, don't thank for a second, that my background and experience doesn't give me a reason for believing what I believe. I may not have experienced combat, but my opinion is just as reasonable to me, as yours is to you. I couldn't even imagine having to be in the same room while some nut job is killing people around me, knowing my gun is at the house, and look up and the barrel is pointed at me.
Just sayin'.....

"Character is doing the right thing even when no one is watching"

Well said!!

I have the utmost respect for our LEOs, and know several personally. That said, I fully understand that they (or others charged with my protection) can not be all places at all times. NO ONE can take responsibility for my protection other than myself. With that in mind, NO ONE should have the right to affect how I chose to protect myself. I am pleased to see that we should be getting some of those rights back (although we never should have had to give them up). I will take full advantage of all means I have at my disposal to assure my safety at all times.

I respect those here that feel otherwise. Fortunately we live in a society that we are not compelled to hold those same views.

 

[Coop45]

I am not saying that not having served in combat makes your opinions less valid, they are, after all, your own opinions. I am saying that I would value the opinion of someone who has BTDT over someone who has not.

BTDT.........you're wrong as hell!

 

[Davetex]

 

[Hoji]

thread

 

[TAZ]

I am not saying that not having served in combat makes your opinions less valid, they are, after all, your own opinions. I am saying that I would value the opinion of someone who has BTDT over someone who has not.

I tend to agree with this statement. So the next time Im on campus and have a need to raid Osama'a office, I'll defer to his experience cause when it comes to special ops leadership he is good to go. On anything else his BTDT is jus one more thing to bp put on a resume.

He is a political creature plain and simple. Knows his stuff when if comes to leading SEALs, but also knows how to lick political testicle to get his next paycheck. This is the same guy who thinks that the Dream Act and in-state tuition for illegals is a good thing. He is pandering to his base audience, which in Austin is pandering to the liberal shitheads on campus. He may very well feel the exact opposite, but won't say squat cause it will cost him. He got the job as Chancellor because he can play the political game well. He appeals to the conservative crowd, because of his military accomplishments. He also appeals to the liberals with his stances on Dream and Campus Carry. Best of all both sides give him a pass when he goes against them. Just look at how people try to make up excuses for his stance.

Whats the difference between a 21 YO legally carrying at the mall or movie theater and a 21 YO legally carrying in a Vector Calculus class? Not a damned thing IMO. Remember we aren't talking about Constitutional Campus Carry, just allowing this if us who have shown a respect for the law to do so.

Aren't CHL holders among the group of people LEAST likely to commit crimes in general. Like lower that LEO in some cases. Why people worry about them is beyond comprehension.


I'm also glad that you felt safe while you were at school. However, I'm certain that the people at VT felt safe, as did those kids in Sandy Hook. I'm also sure that the majority of crime victims felt safe right up to the point where they weren't. Feeling safe does NOT mean that you ARE safe. Nor is the inverse true. I am sick and tired of people using feelings as decision making tools.

 

[locke_n_load]

He is a professional warrior who knows what he is talking about...if he says that guns on campus is dangerous, then I trust his assessment a hell of a lot more than I trust the ravings of uninformed gun nuts who have never experienced a firefight but somehow feel that unrestricted weapon possession is a, "right." Carrying guns on campus is ridiculous...

Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety
~ Benjamin Franklin

Again, I request that you please change your signature, as you have no idea what the statement means.